The Face Of The Program
by willscottonfire on Jan 12, 2012 12:07 PM EST
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PrintRecently there has a been a lot of negativity towards the UL basketball team, and lots of fingers being pointed at Rick Pitino. Although some of it warranted, the truth of the matter is that UL basketball and UL athletics are just fine. As Mike pointed out earlier this morning or last night, the University of Louisville ranks 11th in Director Cup Standings after this fall, where is Kentucky you might ask? 73rd. Grant it Louisville will most likely fall back and Kentucky will probably move forward only because they are one of only 30 schools that offer Rifle as a Division 1 athletic sport and they are typically a top 5 Rifle school.
But something I want to hit on, is this notion that Gene Wozjicowski was trying to hit on, which is the fact that "Big Blue Nation" or Kentucky Basketball is this overwhelming, dominant college basketball program. Yes, in the history of college basketball, Kentucky has some impressive stats, and their recruiting of late has been impressive, but lets be sure to be clear about one important thing. Since Rick Pitino has come to Louisville, Louisville and Kentucky share the most important stat there is: 0 (that's a zero, just in case your curious). Zero Championships, and thanks to UK's run last year have been to the same amount of Final Fours: one. Now maybe that will change, maybe it, won't, but NCAA Men's basketball Championships are harder to win today than ever before. Mid-Majors making tremendous runs, schools as a collective whole playing better basketball, AAU basketball blowing up sending kids to schools all over the country. But the important thing to look at in my eyes, is that over the past 10 years, Kentucky and Louisville basketball have been pretty comparable, Zero Championships, only One Final Four.
With that being said, and really nothing I just wrote about further justifies the next statement other than the fact that anyone who seriously thinks Rick Pitino should a. be fired b. has lost it or c. is a bad coach, must be a Kentucky fan. The guy wins ball games, teaches his players and even coaches about being better people and making life changes to take their lives to the next level. Look at our team, and how many cocky, a**hole, thug, drug addict, uni-brown, head-cases do we have on our team? I'm not trying to say that is Kentucky either but this is happening to programs across the country when you look at the likes of Xavier-Cincy fight, Ole Miss just kicked 5 players off their team for drugs, kids not qualifying academically, the Uni-brow epidemic at UK. We have kids that go to school for 4 years, play hard, and have lives after basketball and become better men. That to me is impressive all in its own. We don't need shady recruiting tactics, Drake, Jay-Z or any of that. We sell our school, our community, and our COACH and we signed what, 4 top 100 players? Which brings me to my next and maybe final point, just depends on how bored I continue to be at work.
You had to see this coming. Sure we started 12-0, but who did we play, and it was apparent we had ZERO offense. It was apparent that we missed Preston out there, and not to mention TJ. We started the season with 19 players, and what now, 9 are injured or transferred? Our prize recruit Wayne Blackshear was injured before he ever even came to Louisville, and might not even see the court until next year? But the more important thing to look at is the positives: Russ Smith, Chane Behanan, Gorgui, guys making strides and showing the true potential that the future is bright, and the most important thing, we have a top 10 coach in the country who makes our team and school better.
That being said, my final point is this: We are the University of Louisville. We have one of the best, if not the best athletic director in the country and at some point in the past 2 years, pretty much every single sports team we have has been ranked in the top 25, our basketball team still made 12 million more dollars this past year than any other school which might help finance a new soccer stadium, our facilities are ridiculous, kids want to play for us, we have great coaches, etc. etc. etc. Life is good, cheer up, our team will still bounce back and fight for us, they always do.
Go Cards.
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Thank you!
The voices of reason are starting to come out now. Your bring up several good points in your post. I’m proud of our bball program and school because I really enjoy all of the players and coaches we have at this institution. Our players are actually students and have majors other than “undergraduate studies” and are overall really likable guys. We’re going to be fine. Go Cards
hahaha
I love how you slid the “uni-brow epidemic” into an otherwise serious post. Nicely done all around.
I just now realized that you and cardchak are different users
This has cleared up a big source of confusion for me :).
Good, I felt the need to reply to his/her posts because I am NOT
a pessimist that thinks that CRP has “lost it”, has to go", or any other such nonsense.
The only time I have ever been truly apathetic about UL Sports was years 1.5 through 3 of Kragtastic-ness.
This team has something up with it, but I don’t think its anything our guys can’t get over/through. Just have to remember that its a TEAM game, I think.
Wait? You made it through the first year of Krag without becoming apathetic?
Better person than I.
by WhiskeyRider on Jan 12, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
yeah...
try doing that at 3 am while in a war zone.
Yeah, Was not a good time for me in Iraq neither!
I was in the Green Zone though, so I had that going for me.
GO! CARDS!
BEAT!
PURDUE!
and bring on the hate in 3...2....1......
by Justin Gingey Smith on Jan 12, 2012 1:12 PM EST reply actions
I hate the haters who hate the hatred of the depth of our hate.
And I hated to have to say that.
by Carolina Cardinal on Jan 12, 2012 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
some of that, I understood.
The rest just seemed hateful.
by Justin Gingey Smith on Jan 12, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
I think that all right-thinking people in this country
are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not! But I’m sick and tired of being told that I am!
I would say sorry I'm late but
I don’t hate Pitino. I think he did an amazing job last year and even will give him a slight pass for the Morehead game because of losing Preston (but I still think we probably should have won). I don’t think he has lost it. But I fear that at this point in the season that he may have lost the team, or at least a significant %. These guys have just received C’s, D’s and F’s on their midterm chemistry exam. Gonna have to really pick it up to get a final B.
Stats
First, let me start by saying I hate posting anything anti-UL on here because I love this site and I know as a UK fan I’m a guest here so I will try to be respectful and just keep to stats.
Anyway, here are some stats that do show that UK has fairly significantly outperformed UL in the NCAA tournament during Rick’s tenure, especially when it comes to consistency. And of course that 10 year stretch includes what was likely UK’s worse 4 year stretch since Rupp.
- UK advanced further than UL in the tournament 6 times in those 10 years with 1 tie.
- UK has 18 tournament wins compared to UL’s 12.
- Elite 8’s: UK – 4, UL – 3
- Sweet 16’s: UK – 5, UL – 3
- Second Round: UK – 8, UL – 5
- UL failed to win a single tournament game 5 of 10 years, UK only did that twice (Gillispie!)
- And finally, head to head is 6-4
One Final Four: One Final Four
Zero national chamoionships: Zero national championships
by Mike Rutherford on Jan 12, 2012 1:34 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Fair Enough
But you wouldn’t trade for UK’s post season success in that time period? Being 1 and done (or not even making the tourney) 50% of the time is pretty rough. 18 wins to 12 is also pretty significant.
you really think thats possible?
Our team has to look like one that wants to play and win instead of some kind of Kragthorpe mess of a lineup that they are right now.
Completely agree
Though I love the tournament so much, and love consistently having hope for my team in the 2nd weekend, I’d give up all the consistent success for another title.
I watch tapes from the 1998 run often and there’s nothing like getting that ultimate reward after dedicating so much of your life to following a team.
I wouldn't trade any calapari based success for the last 4-5 years of Crums tenure
And that was way worse than anything we’re currently going through. At least I hope it is.
You take the last two years out of it (and sincerely, UK fans are the only ones that don’t see the asterik) and it’s not close, 1 FF and 2 EE to one EE.
And I totally said the first part backwards
But I’m guessing you know what i meant
Pitino's first 8 years (No Cal)
Wins: UK – 11, UL – 12
Final Fours: UL – 1, UK – 0
Elite 8’s: UL – 3, UK – 2
Sweet 16’s: UL – 3, UK – 3
Second Round: UK – 6, UL – 5
Head to Head: UK – 4, UL – 4
UK went further in the tournament 4 times, UL 3 times, 1 tie.
I’d say that’s pretty close with a slight edge to UL
I'll give you 100 dollars
if you can name every sweet sixteen team from 2007, or every elite 8 team from last year. No body cares, no body remembers that stuff, and if for some reason you do, you obviously have no time on your hands.
by willscottonfire on Jan 12, 2012 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Actually...
I can remember most of the Elite 8 teams and a decent amount of Sweet 16 teams going back to the mid 2000’s, but I’m a bit of an NCAA tournament nut.
Your post said that postseason success to the two teams in the last 10 years was comparable and I posted the stats to show that UK has had much more consistent and overall success.
To just use final fours and championships is a pretty narrow scope. Would you say that George Mason (3 appearances, 5 wins), VCU (4 appearances, 5 wins), LSU (4 apperances, 5 wins), etc all have comparable results to UK or even UL? I doubt it. But all three have 0 championships and 1 final four.
Of the top of my head (promise)
2011 Elite 8:
UK (4) vs. UNC (2)
Arizona (5) vs. UConn (3)
KU (1) vs. VCU (11?)
Butler (8?) vs. Florida (2?)
2007 is a little more rough cause I missed a decent amount of the tournament visiting my fiancee but here’s what I can come up with:
I know the final four was…
OSU
Florida
UCLA
Georgetown
Pretty sure these teams were in the Elite Eight…
Memphis
Kansas
UNC
I know these teams were in the Sweet 16…
Texas A&M
Guessing on these…
Michigan St
Tennessee
Pitt
UConn
I know Memphis beat Texas A&M
After Googling
Missed:
Butler
Oregon
UNLV
Southern Illinois
USC
Vandy
Can’t believe I forgot the Kevin Durant / OJ Mayo game and USC getting to the S16…
Also distinctly remembered the ending of the Georgetown / Vandy game but couldn’t remember who the team was that Georgetown was playing.
really? i'm not even going to google this
VCU beat Kansas. Butler beat Florida. Connecticut beat Arizona starring Derrick Williams. Kentucky beat North Carolina.
do i need to go back the past 5 years to win 100 dollars?
I believe Calipari said when we was hired at UK: "They don't put banners up here for anything else except national champions."
And of course, NBA first round draft picks.
by CardinalDude on Jan 12, 2012 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
I thought UK only recognizes
National Championships and Final Fours?
0:0
1:1
Thank you, drive through.
by twistedwedge on Jan 12, 2012 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
They have banners for NC's, Final Fours and SEC Tournament Champs
I had to sit there for 4 hours back in May at my sister’s graduation. It was hell.
Im so sorry you had to suffer through anything at Rupp
Ive never been there, never plan to.
Just figured I would bring up the "banner" thing because thats what I always hear from all the UK fans I know.
by twistedwedge on Jan 12, 2012 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
We saw Jimmy Buffett there
And the benefit of the high seats was so many fumes kept rising up to us that while the seats weren’t free, the high was.
The word you are looking for is
Granted
Sorry to pick on that but I could not help it. The other thing I want to pick at is this notion that Jurich is not fallible. He is really really good but so far one big mistake set us back 3-4 years in football. That can not and should not, better not, happen to our basketball program. The fact is there is a percentage of the UofL fan base that remember that Pitino was the coach at UK (and the man himself brings it up fairly often!). I think you can draw the parallel that what Pitino was to Crum, Calapari is now that to Pitino. The only way that is not the case is if we make the tournament this year and do not lose again in the first round, otherwise it is 3 straight years of a bad taste at the end of the season (maybe even 4 if you count how terrible the loss to Mich State felt).
That's it!
That is the exact thing I wanted to read. Sometimes I sit and read everyone’s opinions on hear and can feel myself getting sucked into something I don’t want to hear, feel, or believe. This is a great post and reminds me why I am a Louisville fan. I love my Cards and will back them through it all and will never be anything but a Cardinal. It gets frustrating at times yes, but we have an amazing fan base. At the end of the day, I am a Cardinal through the easy times and the hard times. I will continue to have faith in all of our athletes, coaches, teachers, etc because that is what a family does
by eoleigh5 on Jan 12, 2012 1:23 PM EST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
I too worry about being sucked into negativity when I spend too much time here.
But then we get to read awesome things like this and Mike’s Depaul day post and faith is restored.
Go Cards
by bythesidewalk on Jan 12, 2012 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
We are fine? I'll be fine when they lower my donations for MY season tickets.
We weren’t fine versus Michigan State, Cal or Morehead State. That is what WE are judged on….not “regular” season games.
STOP APOLOGIZING FOR MEDIOCRITY! This fanbase is not as gullible as you think. Pitino is a has been. His team is in disarray and his system’s time has passed.
My biggest concern is that Rick's "system" doesn't seem to be working - offensively of defensively.
And I worry that, given his prior success with it, he will hold onto it until it might be too late. Any “system” that 4 and 5 star athletes cannot learn or function in for a year or more, needs to be seriously looked at. This cannot possibly be a positive for recruits looking at our program.
by Carolina Cardinal on Jan 12, 2012 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
Certainly agree that it isn't working NOW
But this has always been a 2nd-half team. Pitino’s system just takes a longer system to digest. Some coaches manage to teach successful systems that don’t make their players look like children on the court, but hey.
They have their system, we have ours.
by Justin Gingey Smith on Jan 12, 2012 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
It's always been a second half team
just like it’s always been a “next year” team as in “we’ll be a lot better next year we’ll never lose to Morehead in the first round”
BASKETBALL!
by Irememberwheat! on Jan 12, 2012 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
I don't remember saying that about Morehead specifically, but I agree.
but I do believe it’s impossible to judge teams like ours until late in the season.
by Justin Gingey Smith on Jan 12, 2012 2:08 PM EST up reply actions
And to be clear, I don't hate Pitino. In fact I think he is/was a great coach. Likely Hall of Famer. But..........
I also know that he has been very successful for 30+ years doing things his way. And his inclination will be to keep trying to make that work, because it always has. Very logical from his perspective. But remember when Denny was in his declining years? Three point shot came and he resisted in favor of posting up bigger guards and getting the ball in deep. He simply would not change. You could see that that 20 footer for 3 points was not that hard a shot and getting three points versus your opponents two was a very good deal. But he was simply not willing to change his beliefs.
Now we are in the age on elite players going to programs where they will get exposure and playing time right away. And will likely not be with the program more than a year or two at the most. And you know that going in. So, a system that makes it both hard for a freshman to get playing time and to pay in a system that takes a very long time to become proficient in, cannot possibly be appealing to these types of players. My concern is that Rick will hold onto that system because of it’s previous success (much like Denny did) and will not be able to consistently recruit many top level athletes.
Doesn’t make him a bad person, but may prevent us from being a top level program in today’s world.
Your thoughts?
by Carolina Cardinal on Jan 12, 2012 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
could not agree more, and I don't believe I'd word anything differently.
In a few years, comparisons between him and Crum will become standard. Frankly, if I were a freshman and saw what I’d have to go through to come out with (let’s be honest) the same results, no way I’d commit to CRP.
But hey, Gill! Lookin’ good dude! We’re excited to have you.
by Justin Gingey Smith on Jan 12, 2012 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Good insight...
…and a very accurate comparison of Crum and Pitino and their hanging onto successful past tactics. Change is inevitable, but some poeple can’t/won’t/don’t roll with it.
Does Rick's "system" contribite to injuries?
After 11 years, I am suspicious that it does. We seem to always have several player(s) playing with injuries, more than I remember with Crum…or RP at UK for that matter.
The sky is falling.
In a sign of pessimism about humanity’s the Cardinal’s future, scientists today set the hands of the infamous “Doomsday Clock” forward one minute.
Less optimism now than a year ago
For one, its a game. Its a team/program of which there is no doubt that we all love. Most of us have kids, families, people we love and love us – and that aspect of our lives deserve the scrutiny that some of us are pouring into this. We have a HOF coach that is still figuring this team out and a team that is still figuring the coach out. These are kids, CRP has won almost 73% of the games since he’s come here – during which time we’ve seen high’s and low’s. What doesn’t change is that these are OUR guys, and they deserve our support no matter what. The season is far from over. Changes need to be made, yes; but we’ve all seen/heard of possible chemistry issues, and that is for the kids and the coach to straighten out. Cheer for this team – our coach included, as they apparently need the FANS’ support now more than ever. Keep life in general in perspective, beat UK, fuck WVU, Memphis State sucks, and GO CARDS.
Awesome post and Go Cards
Don’t care, I will keep the positivity alive.
And I think we can all make this post better by refusing to respond to anything negative. We should all just be cheering for our team and believing.
by bythesidewalk on Jan 12, 2012 1:38 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Playas they gonna play
And haters they gonna hate
Ballers they gonna ball
Shot callers they gonna call
That ain’t got nothing to do with me and you
That’s the way it isPlayas they gonna play
And haters they gonna hate
Ballers they gonna ball
Shot callers they gonna call
That ain’t got nothing to do with me and you
That’s the way it is
by bythesidewalk on Jan 12, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
On the Unibrow References
I’m sorry but there’s really not a guy in this UK recruiting class that I dislike as a asshole or jerk or whatever besides maybe the guy that we wanted so badly, Teague. Davis doesn’t really talk shit or do anything to hate that I’ve seen. When you put it that way Chane Behanan is more of a shit talking punk than that guy.
Otherwise good post, I just don’t understand the whole reference to the hair that keeps the sweat out of his eyes.
If you can show me some case where Anthony Davis is some kind of jerk-wad please do. I’d like to see it otherwise I think he’s a pretty damn good player.
by gary west on Jan 12, 2012 1:44 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I agree. MKG and Anthony Davis seem like really good kids. Nothing like Calipari’s first year
by midwestkids on Jan 12, 2012 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I believe the author was just trying to
have a little fun. Something that is severely lacking around here these days….
by twistedwedge on Jan 12, 2012 4:07 PM EST up reply actions
You just proved Wojo right.
UK has been the better program over the history of college basketball, has been the better program over the last 10 years, and is the better program today. There is no comparison. And what the hell does having 4 year players have to do with what Wojo said? When is the last time UL had a bunch of 4 year players win a NC? And how does making fun of UK’s players make your case? I am pretty sure that Pitino has recruited some bad apples to UL over the years. Bottom line, UK is headed in a different direction than UL. Coach Cal is leading UK to Final Fours and #1 recruiting classes, and Pitino is leading UL to NIT’s, first round losses in the NCAA Tournament, and the front page of the tabloids. But it makes perfect sense to say something negative about the kids that play at UK when the UL basketball program is sinking faster than the Titantic. Makes perfect sense.
by ScottWalls on Jan 12, 2012 1:47 PM EST via mobile reply actions
football
hey but basketball doesn’t matter in college sports. Football rules all and louisville is going to solidify itself as a much better football program
CHARLIE>CAL
by louisvillefootball on Jan 12, 2012 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
"There is no comparison."
Actually, if you acknowledge that four of UK’s seven titles were earned before black players were allowed to play (a stance that Adolph Rupp supported actively), there starts to be sort of a comparison. Also, what are you doing here? Trying to present facts while blatantly trolling? How do you feel when UL fans do that on UK sites?
by doctorofdunk on Jan 12, 2012 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sure your current players would love acknowledging that hallowed tradition when they would've been a.) not allowed to play and b.) spit on in the stands
But keep ignoring that, please.
by doctorofdunk on Jan 12, 2012 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
That's your rebuttal? Really?
I’m done.
by doctorofdunk on Jan 12, 2012 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
You should be.
Why would anybody care about Rupp being a racist? He is dead. He wasn’t even the coach when I started watching UK play, and these players probably don’t know anything about him. So who cares.
Scott, whoever the hell you are
You can’t rub his four titles in our face and then try and say that it doesn’t matter because “he is dead.” You’re doing a great job repping for “Hypocritical and uninformed UK fan,” though. Keep it up.
by doctorofdunk on Jan 12, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
I never said the titles didn't matter, so learn to read.
I said why does it matter, especially now, that Rupp was a racist? Babe Ruth was a drunk and a womanizer, does that take away from what he accomplished in baseball? No it doesn’t. The 4 titles that Rupp won at UK count. Just like the 2 that Denny won almost 30 years ago count.
Reading comprehension problems
I know you THINK the titles matter, Scott. That’s why you came on here like a passive-aggressive troll. What I’m saying is that you want to be cool with his titles, throw in some relativistic shit about “oh, hey, that’s just the way things were back then,” and put seven fingers up, that’s your choice. If you do that, though, I’m going to remind you that some people would have a major problem with that, and justifiably so. Also, you never answered my question about how you feel when UL fans come on UK sites and spew this kind of crap (and I know they do). Pretty annoying, isn’t it?
by doctorofdunk on Jan 12, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
I don't mind when UL fans come on a UK site.
I have had a couple of conversations with Chick and Iwantreecegainesback over at ASOB. So there you happy. Doesn’t bother me at all. I didn’t come on here and say UL sucks or anything like that. If you think that Rupp being a racist is a big deal and takes away from the titles, so be it. You are wrong, but you can have what ever opinion you want. Lots of coaches back in the day were racist, should we strip them of their record as well?
Here is what you said
“Coach Cal is leading UK to Final Fours and #1 recruiting classes, and Pitino is leading UL to NIT’s, first round losses in the NCAA Tournament, and the front page of the tabloids.”
That’s not saying that UL sucks, huh?
And I can have the opinion that Rupp being a racist is “a big deal,” but that makes me wrong? Where did you learn to debate, son?
Lots of coaches were racist, “back in the day,” you’re right. But guess what? There aren’t quite as many teams, or fan bases, that take as much pride in some of those accomplishments as UK fans do. You’re not WRONG to take pride in it, but I’m also not WRONG to point out that it seems hypocritical to me. Stating a preference on something is not wrong.
by doctorofdunk on Jan 12, 2012 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Can we remove UK trolls?
Why are they so obsessed with louisville that they have to join a blog for “Louisville Cardinal fans”? No place is safe from those arrogant people.
by RedHeadfortheRedBirds on Jan 12, 2012 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
If you ignore them
they will go away. Trolls are after one thing: a reaction. Don’t feed the trolls.
"I am willing to donate to the charity that is working on the prevention of whatever the hell Dick Vitale has." - noobmaster
This still doesn’t make very much sense to me. We take pride in the national championships and Rupp’s coaching ability, but not his racism.
An analogy as a counterargument:
Many Americans take pride in the Declaration of Independence as a influential and revolutionary document. However, Thomas Jefferson was a known slaveholder, and thus by extension, a racist. And yet, today Americans have elected a black president. Is any American who both appreciates the Declaration of Independence and voted for Obama a hypocrite? By this logic, I believe you would have to say they were, right?
Why should anyone care about Rupp being a racist?
Similar reasoning to why every should care what Hitler did to Jews.
If you disagree, you’re in the same camp with holocaust-denying Ahmadinejad.
You can't be serious about this
…can you?
a) No one is denying Rupp is a racist, so this doesn’t put UK fans who acknowledge that he won 4 valid titles in the same camp as Holocaust deniers.
b) No one is condoning racism, just like no one except for a few crazy neo-Nazis condone Hitler.
c) Rupp was a racist, but he did not try and murder all black people. He did not introduce any bills into the legislature that denied rights to black people. He did (for a period) not recruit black players to a college basketball team. To compare that to one of the most atrocious human rights violations of all time is ridiculous.
I’m not saying that you should not or cannot care about Rupp being a racist. Racism sucks. But just because you condemn racism doesn’t mean that those 4 national titles didn’t happen, or “count” historically, and it doesn’t mean he wasn’t a good basketball coach. If you are going to discount every human accomplishment by a person who happened to hold racist views, then you are going to have to throw out the majority of western history, unfortunately.
Nor did I say these two men were comparable
What I clearly wrote was the REASON why everyone should care.
The REASON is because if you don’t stand up against hate (racism, et al), if you don’t recognize hate (racism, et al), then you are an enabler of it.
Well then, yes, agreed
Of course turning a blind eye to racism, sexism, pedophilia (just citing recent examples) is enabling, we can all agree on that. But I do think comparing someone who says that current recruits to team who had a racist basketball coach over 50 years ago shouldn’t be too concerned with that history to a Holocaust denier is a little melodramatic.
Also, sorry about the 4 titles didn’t count point, I guess that was still my response to the original point above that UK’s first four titles shouldn’t count in historical consideration because Rupp was a racist.
Anyway, we all agree that racism is terrible and I think we’re just arguing semantics here so I’ll get off this board. Good luck to the rest of your season and I hope you guys can turn it around.
Please don't crucify me, but...
This is my first post on Card Chronicle, but I read fairly regularly because I appreciate the wit and humor of this site and the majority of its commenters. That’s why I’m on here as a UK fan (because, quite frankly, I have too much down time at work), and so hopefully you all don’t see this as “trolling.”
So, as a UK fan, I have to say this argument is a major red herring, and a tired one at that. Yes, four of UK’s titles were won before black players were allowed to play—which means that everyone was on a level playing field in terms of personnel available. This does not invalidate these championships; we did not cheat to win them.
Was Adolph Rupp a racist? Yes. And it is a blight on his legacy in the same way the Bob Knight throwing chairs and choking out his players harms his. It means he is a bad person, but not a bad basketball coach. Glaring personality flaws can be found in many championship coaches throughout the years.
Also, it is a little foolish to claim that somehow Louisville was not a racist place in the 1940s and 50s, and that somehow UofL has this claim on being a bastion of civil rights for sports programs and fans. Unfortunately ,both fan bases contained racist members back then, and they both do today. Luckily, I think we can exclude everyone on this board from that group.
by kmjonec on Jan 12, 2012 3:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This man claims to be a UK fan.
And yet he presented a logical argument in complete sentences.
Troll.
by Jason G on Jan 12, 2012 3:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Being a racist is a leeetle bit higher on the list of asshole-ness than being a hothead.
Just sayin’.
Louisville was much quicker to embrace black players than Kentucky. We had black players when old Adolph was still fielding lily-white teams.
And your arena still bears his name. Another Adolf comes to mind. He is dead too, but you don’t see things in Germany named after him.
"I am willing to donate to the charity that is working on the prevention of whatever the hell Dick Vitale has." - noobmaster
by rickmbari on Jan 12, 2012 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Being a mass murderer and instigating one of the worst wars of all time is a leeeetle bit higher on the list of asshole-ness than just being a racist basketball coach in the 1950s.
Just sayin’.
Tellya what.
I’ll agree with you if you meet me at Bobby Knight Arena in Bloomington or Jerry Sandusky Field in State College
"I am willing to donate to the charity that is working on the prevention of whatever the hell Dick Vitale has." - noobmaster
How about I meet you in Jefferson County, KY
Home of the Louisville Cardinals and named after a known slaveholder and racist, Thomas Jefferson.
(I know that apologist arguments for Jefferson can be made that mostly consist of “it was a different time! He did sort-of progressive things in regards to slavery”, but you can use the "It was a different time!/culture arguments for Rupp, too. But both men are revered for career accomplishments, not personal views. I think it’s equally silly to condemn a fanbase for having its arena named after the legendary, hall of fame coach that built its program as it is to condemn a county for being named after the founding father of its nation. Just sayin’.)
I don't think UofL has any say in what the county is named.
but you can believe whatever you want, you’re a UK fan.
I’m gonna take my own advice and stop feeding the troll now. Have a nice day.
"I am willing to donate to the charity that is working on the prevention of whatever the hell Dick Vitale has." - noobmaster
Also, to Knight generally being a dick (which I think is something fans of both programs can agree on)
He did once make the statement that, when being raped, if it is inevitable to stop it, one should just “lay back and enjoy it.”
So, sexism < racism? Sexism > racism? Both are still pretty gross. But it doesn’t change the fact that IU has 3 more national championships because of him, no matter how much I dislike their program.
sinking faster than the Titantic
It took almost three hours for the Titanic to sink. So there’s that.
by Leeroy Jenkins on Jan 12, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
And when is the last time UK had a bunch of any players win a NC?
Oh yeah, 14 years ago. Go ahead and make the argument “Well UL’s last one was 26 years ago!”, I give zero f***s. I was 6 when UK won it’s last championship and -6 when UL won it’s last. Each program has the same number of national championships in the past 30-something years and in the past 10: 2 and 0. If you really want to go back, UK outshines UL a staggering 3-2 in championships since Watergate (quite awhile ago). Quit harping on victories from when your parents had to listen to the game on the radio as the bases for the “UK is superior in every facet” argument.
As for the 7 vs 2 note, everyone always seems to forget that the NIT and NCAA tournaments were seen as equals by many until the NCAA expansion to 32 teams in the late 70s so even if you count the Rupp championships as a half-championship (which seems the only logical thing to do because the NIT champions and NCAA champions never played for outright title rights), the overall record is 5.5-2.5 (both UK and UL had NIT championships in the 40s and 50s).
And I still don’t give a damn about anything that happened before the dawn of hot pants.
by CardiacCards on Jan 12, 2012 3:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It's no secret that UK has experienced more overall success than UL. What's the significance of restating it?
A comparison of the team’s records will certainly show that UK has won more. Believe it or not, for the following reasons, (most) UL fans can sleep peacefully at night despite this:
(1) UL has its own proud tradition that requires no defense or apology.
(2) Given that both traditions are rich, the next consideration is the experience and culture of the fan base. To the extent that it’s a subjective determination, then I don’t know which fan base is superior. To the extent that this blog and its many thoughtful followers objectively exist, however, red gets a point.
.
(3) To own UK’s winning percentage as a fan also requires owning UK’s collective culture and attitude. Can’t speak for all UL fans, but being a UK fan has never once in 32 years looked appealing. To be clear, this is not a judgment on the character of individual UK fans as half my family bleeds blue. Rather, (and I’m sure the feeling is mutual) I don’t like the way UK nation collectively rolls — it has always been unsettling in the way that a Breaking Bad character high on meth is unsettling.
(4) I like the way that the UL fan base rolls. And if there were any doubt, the majority of the posts and comments on this blog during the last few weeks demonstrates why I’d rather suffer an embarrassing and disastrous loss with this fan base than celebrate a dynasty with any other.
Not that any of this should stop you from continuing to post your records and stats for mini-boosts of self confidence. Just wanted to make sure that you knew where we stood.
by WindyCityCard on Jan 13, 2012 12:34 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
good post but
I hate to hear anything at all about Kentucky when talkin Louisville, the thing people don’t consider is just how dominating cal has been on the recruiting trail, yes it will fizzle away after a new hot face takes his place, Kentucky is on top right now,,they just are, so its kinda unfair to base everything we do and don’t do on what cals doing,,guys are too close to the forest to see the trees ,,one thing I intially thought was crazy about his tactics tho that now I’m starting to agree with is this,,cal says he don’t let his guys watch much or any film of the opponent before games.I’m starting to agree with that,,we are beating ourselves Louisville,,who cares what providence does,,they should never have beat us,,we need work on ourselves and our offense needs a complete 180. So stop nit picking the small things against providence,,it wasn’t the system, but rather our mentality..when can we see some unity, when can finally see some aggresion or physicality,,I’m tired of blaming our guys for being soft, like e5 and samardo,,I don’t want thugs but maybe in a big man its ok, like cousins or yancy gates,,we have no one but our coach for any team or player to fear,,we need big changes in the intire make up of our team
by HaHaSypher on Jan 12, 2012 1:51 PM EST via mobile reply actions
My eyes are stabbing needles of agony
by Leeroy Jenkins on Jan 12, 2012 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
UK is on fire on the recruiting trail
because they have a payroll bigger than the Pony Express in the 80s
so we are just recycling the same script here
BASKETBALL!
by Irememberwheat! on Jan 12, 2012 1:51 PM EST reply actions
I'm just trying to be realistic
better than the Pitino circlejerk that goes on here all the time.
BASKETBALL!
by Irememberwheat! on Jan 12, 2012 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
If you want to panic -
there’s always ITV, which is a forum. Forums are a democracy. This blog, for better or for worse, is not. Mike is our benevolent dictator, and people gravitate towards this site because they like his humor, intelligence and ability to put sports in a broader perspective.
I can’t speak for him, but in my opinion, if you don’t like the tone of Card Chronicle, which a lot of people on here find more akin to reasonable discussion than a ‘circlejerk’, you know where the door is.
football
why do we always have to talk about basketball
CHARLIE >RICK
by louisvillefootball on Jan 12, 2012 2:00 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
proud louisville fan
But honestly these types of blogs make me ashamed of my own fan base,,I hate that Rick and the guys could and do possibly read this and see how our fans think of our coach and players, I’m honestly ok with our success, shit I’m proud of my squad. There is none better than pitino, but talent is everything in basketball and the talent just isn’t final four talent. I think regular we have been very good , but yes in the tournament we lack confidence, and yes we would have beat Michigan state had we not had the same mentality as we did against providence..Go Cards! Uconn was a 9 seed in the big east last year with the best pg in ncaa basketball. Be patient cause when Siva comes around we will ne back,,I honesty feel we will right the ship and make a good run this year,,GO CARDS& COACH PITINO!!
by HaHaSypher on Jan 12, 2012 2:04 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I am here because I can be, I didn't say anything out of line.
Denny Crum was a hall of fame coach that won 2 NC’s for UL and was a man of great character and he got run off because he had lost his touch. Rick Pitino could be a hall of fame coach that won a NC for UL’s biggest rival, has a horrible attitude, especially towards UL’s fan base, and let his personal issues hurt the program. Why does Rick get a pass but Denny got fired?
I think it is a fair question, no matter who it comes from.
I am a UK fan, and I am trying to be objective. Denny got fired and had a much better record and was a much better person.
RP has kept U of L out of NCAA trouble
Denny not so much.
That is huge for Jurich.
Last time I checked
calipari hasn’t won a NC ever, for any school
by willscottonfire on Jan 12, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
What is your point?
He is getting beat by 31 pts by what a lot of people consider to be a very bad team. He is getting eliminated in the first round of the NCAA tournament. He isn’t losing recruits left and right for what ever reason. And he owns Rick since he came to UK. If Cal starts unperforming like Rick, he will get fired.
Casualgamerreed is that you?
"To win the game is great. To play the game is greater. But to love the game is greatest of all."
by kentuckybred on Jan 12, 2012 2:53 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
I always find it interesting the comparison
of Denny to Rick far as personal decisions go. Doesnt anyone remember that ‘ol Denny was fooling around with Sweeny before he "should have"? Is it "ok" because those things werent happening in the public eye?
I respect Denny for what he did for our program as a COACH, and always will. I just dont see why people cant drop the personal shit…
by twistedwedge on Jan 12, 2012 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
Note from the writer
I have never and will never visit a University of Kentucky Athletics blog. Especially if my “profile picture” makes me look like a tool.
by willscottonfire on Jan 12, 2012 2:30 PM EST reply actions
Hate to say it
But there aren’t any UK blogs anywhere near the level of this one.
Sorry KSR.
This post is ridiculous in many ways.
First of all you are referring to Cal’s shady recruiting tactics and recruitment of “thugs” at Kentucky as justification for him blowing Pitino out of the water in recruiting. When in fact you have no proof that anything shady is going on at UK other than the fact that he continues to put guys in the league year after year which attracts big names. And as another poster mentioned, there are no Demarcus Cousins on this team either, they seem like pretty decent guys except for Jones who is a little thuggish.
Second of all I’m sick of people calling out Pitino’s detractors as if we had a three game losing streak so all of us JUST NOW decided we don’t like the guy. As if we are that fickle. No, our resentment of the man is based on his entire body of work relative to his high pay and resources, and what appears to be a year that is slipping through his fingers even though this was supposed to be THE year. I’m not waiting for next year again. Been waiting for a decade. IF he turns things around this year and has a deep run, I will lay off him for a while. Other than that, I’m over him.
Seriously, calling us UK fans? GTFO.
by Jason G on Jan 12, 2012 2:41 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I agree,... people have every right to be critical right now, for many reasons. They have just as much right to that as others have to be supportive.
Personally, I think we should all take James’ advise and look at pictures of monkeys doing people shit.
I’ll tell you what I’m over,… I’m over the radicals on both sides of this debate. Anyone who thinks Rick should be fired ASAP, or HAS TO GO based on where we are now, is on the fringe just as much as anyone who thinks he’s just fine and we’re “Lucky to have him.”
I don’t think there’s another coach more qualified to get the ship heading in the right direction from now until March.
But I also think that he’s had plenty of time, resources, leeway, and support from the administration/ fans to accomplish more than he has. Players quit playing the other night and he sat down and quit coaching. That’s not even debatable.
No matter how much people want to act like it’s not part of this it is, so I’ll throw it out there because I agree with Jason that the heat Rick is taking has been an accumulation of ill will.
When the scandal happened, I think people fell into three distinct groups.
(1) "I hate him, I’ll never respect him again, and we should fire him yesterday.
(2) "Everyone deserves a second chance, we’ve been to a Final Four and pair of Elite8s int he last few years and we should keep him, forgive him, and move on.
(3) {This is my group BTW} “I don’t care if he stays or goes, this program is bigger than him and we could get another really good coach; but, he has had recent success so I’m not opposed to keeping him. Either way, all I care about is that the program keeps moving in the right direction ie: recruits, wins, tournament success.”
Well, the recruits/ wins/ tourney success haven’t been there. I know we’re injured this year and that sucks, but there’s no one to blame for not being able to turn to anyone else in place of Kyle, Gorgui, Chris, ect when they’re in foul trouble, not playing well, or need a rest,…….. except Rick Pitino
Group three were the “just show me your still the guy” group when TJ decided to keep him. Which, FWIW, I don’t think he would have done if Kragthorpe had turned out to be amazing and the football team wasn’t in the tank (it’s always been my opinion that Tom couldn’t afford the risk of letting Rick go and making another bad hire at that point, no matter what he had done up until then).
So far he hasn’t shown enough, he still might, but after seeing the players quit the other night and him looking like he didn’t give a dam for the last 15 minutes of that game? Well,…. lets just say that a whole lot of people came down off the fence, myself included. If he doesn’t get this group playing well, winning games, into the tournament, and get past the first weekend this year? I will be calling for his job and anyone who doesn’t needs to really examine what their expectations for this program are.
Because IMO, those expectations need to be pretty high. A lot higher than the results we’ve seen/ are seeing this year. There is still time to fix this, I think? I want nothing more than for our seniors to go out on a strong note. But if that doesn’t happen, I’ll be about as disappointed in the state of affairs here as I’ve ever been. I want nothing more than for that to NOT happen.
OUT
Fool's names are like their faces, often seen in public places.
Follow @ChickStratino
by Chick-Stratino'sUrDaddy on Jan 12, 2012 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
A post called face of the progam
and it’s not about Russ Smith?
by cardscott5 on Jan 12, 2012 2:43 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
wow
I didn’t realize denny played in the big east? Yea I’m sure bj flynn would have dominated this league like he did in conference USA. Why do Kentucky fans sign up to Louisville blogs? Louisville fans get caught in Kentucky envy of Louisville. Coach Cal wouldn’t be gettin one seeds if he played in the big east. Don’t believe me? How’s your squad of NBA all stars faired in the tournament when you have faced a big east team,,not to well huh, I geuss pitino does suck huh, we beat uconn twice last year and was marra free throws away from beating them the third time.. people are so quik to forget..we just almost one the big east tourny LAST YEAR
by HaHaSypher on Jan 12, 2012 2:49 PM EST via mobile reply actions
but you know some people's mentality
what have you done for me lately.
Awww
it’s ok little troll, go back to your cave. I know you don’t care about us and think we suck and that’s why you found the need to post a paragraph on a LOUISVILLE blog. For as awesome as UK is and elite as you all are you just can’t seem to quit thinking about us and get our name out of your mouth. It’s really flattering you all think about us so much.
I like the optimism in this post,
but why does everyone have to compare us to what UK is doing? That seems to be a huge source of a lot of problems. The post started with comparing UL and UK’s success or lack thereof in the tournament but there is one huge difference that you neglected to state. UK didn’t put up with lack of success and off court issues with their head coach and their coaches were fired.. We keep thinking CRP is going to deliver year after year and he doesn’t. I’m a fan of UL athletics. I’ve paid hard earned money for my football and basketball tickets. I’ve stood out in the snow and cold to watch the soccer team and traveled to cheer on our football cards in bowl games cause I love our teams for what they do, not for what they do better than UK.
by cardchomp on Jan 12, 2012 2:51 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
+1
Great response. Couldn’t agree more. I wonder how many of these kids who post on Card Chronicle actually have season basketball tickets? I’m sure they will all claim they do, but my money is they probably don’t have season tickets and probably go to IUS
by willscottonfire on Jan 12, 2012 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
Good post
This team is working so hard to please the fans that they can’t relax when playing ball. They want to win for you, the fans. They want to be the best ball players they can be. They go to class early in the morning so they can go to individual workouts so they can get better, study hall to keep up their grades, conditioning to be stronger, practice to learn to play better, film to study opponents, and it’s all for us. It’s all so we can stand up and cheer and pat ourselves on the backs and say our team is the best one or at least better then your team. It’s all for people like us that post on blogs and try to criticize everyone that doesn’t make them feel good. Well I liked the post, The Face of the Program, and I like the team, and I like the coaches including Coach P. They deserve better. They deserve fans who are going to love them no matter if they win by 50 pts. or lose by 50. Those are the fans who will get the most out of this team, because they will cheer and support and lift up the team on the court and off the court. WE LOVE YOU CARDS! KEEP PLAYING!
by cardinalmom on Jan 12, 2012 2:53 PM EST reply actions 8 recs
Oh, yeah poor Coach P.
I feel so sorry for him. His life will be so terrible if he gets run off.
that just happened
This is all getting quite absurd. It might be close to the time Mike turns the comments off.
This thread has run its course. Too much vitriol and condescension among members of the same ‘community’. CRP isn’t going anywhere. ADTJ knows what he is doing. Cheer for your team, or don’t. That’s up to each individual here, opinions aside.
Hey if people keep posting threads about coach p
I’m going to continue to comment on them. If the moderators get tired of seeing it, they can delete the fan posts.
I don’t really see how pointing out the fact that with or without UofL he is a multi millionaire who can do WHATEVER HE WANTS the rest of his life is so condescending that it deserves deletion, but whatever.
I’ll be at the game Saturday cheering. You need to learn how to differentiate not liking the coach and not being a good fan.
I do, thanks.
Was just pointing out the vitriol was unnecessary in response to cardinalmom. That was an entirely positive post, and was undeserving of the snark in which it was replied to.
Cheer loud. Support the team, good man.
#gocards
Well, if it makes you feel better
I’m about tired of beating a dead horse so I’m probably about done commenting about Pitino lol.
Good post
I know I’ve been bitching since the Prov loss and going crazy and complaining about every aspect of our team and not noticing any positive like many others have, but it’s all out of love. Just like that girlfriend that you love but occasionally she drives you nuts, you’re not gonna leave her or quit loving her, but occasionally you need to complain about it with your buddies and have beer to get over it.
I want to know how a post titled "The Face of the Program" attacted UK fans to the site to read it.
Especially, if Louisville doesn’t exist and UK fans care nothing about Louisville…which doesn’t exist.
I’ll hang up and listen.
Stout Out!
Nice try at defending Pitino
But if I were you I would have started, and (emphasized heavely) that he has not had a hint an NCAA violation in the entire time he has been here. Any Pitino defender would be well served to hammer home that point over defending his coaching record while at U of L, and for that matter the Celtics before as well. NOT TOO GOOD
The comparisones to UK get old, although I do them myself too on occasion. How can you not? I would suggest that a truly competitive minded fan might refrain from using the fact that both programs have 0 championships during RP’s time here as a defense. It seems to be a bit of a “P word” defense. Who gives a rat’s ass what UK is doing during Pitino’s time here? What I care about is what the CARDS are doing, and the overall program environment. Competing for National Championships HERE. Is UK cheating? Almost certainly now on some level I would think. Is U of L? No…I don’t think so.
Calling people who don’t want Pitino here “UK fans” is down right “P word”. News flash…UK fans are either A) Laughing or B) scratching their heads and having pity on us, if they are nice. The nasty UK fans LOVE having Pitino here. They are beating his ass, and he has proven to be a very weak threat to get Louisville more than 1 Final Four banner while he is here. They are LOVING that!
I would suggest lame attempts to defend Pitino would be more likely to come from a UK fan than the opposite.
Get a clue.
I PREDICT THAT LOUISVILLE WILL CRUSH DEPAUL.
There will be a resergence of some sort this season. Final Four? Not likely. If so he deserves to be vindicated to some degree.
Anything short of a total disaster and HE will trumpet about how HE saved the day, and his minions will all extoll that he truly is the finest coach in all the land. Sing the praises of how he righted the wayward young men on the team.
Never mind that the preseason hype was this was the team that he always dreamed of having…until he ran their D’s in the dirt and hurt a slew of them. (cue Peyton Siva quote).
The great and Powerful OZ will have spoken. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.
Its a show alright…with no banners in sight.
I appreciate your response
the UK fan reference was moreso related to the b. and c. portion of the response and more or less mentioning that firing Pitino would be ridiculous. Also, it was more of a joke than anything.
by willscottonfire on Jan 12, 2012 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
Can't fire him now...
and I would not even be for that myself. If he keeps bombing my hope is that he will call it quits by next year at the latest.
If things go completely in the toilet he will either get fired or quit. Not likely, but definitley possible at this point.
Either way…he seems to be very troubled.
The nasty UK fans want Pitino here?
Think again. They want him crushed, humiliated, fired, and run out of basketball. They will hate him forever for coming to U of L. They are loving that some U of L fans are turning on him too. That gives them common cause. They’ll do what they can to help agitate U of L fans so they can hurt Pitino.
Don’t you know any of these people?
Caveat: I am talking only about the “nasty UK fans.” There are plenty of UK fans that aren’t nasty. Those people appreciate what Pitino did for UK and see no need to smear him on message boards or elsewhere.
"Final Four? Not likely. If so he deserves to be vindicated"
Here’s hoping you remember to honor your words.
if we had zero injuries then it would be different , so ill hold off on fire pitino for now
by jamesc11 on Jan 12, 2012 3:00 PM EST via mobile reply actions
if we had zero injuries then it would be different , so ill hold off on fire pitino for now
by jamesc11 on Jan 12, 2012 3:03 PM EST via mobile reply actions
just for S&G...
we win out and no one remembers the loss to the friars. win the BE tourney and what 3 game skid. win the first game in the dance, the stars are alined. make it to the final 4 and hugs abound. everyone has the right to be upset (this is america and it’s allowed) just don’t take it too far.
oh absolutely
but do you really think this is what will play out?
by Chip Constant on Jan 12, 2012 3:29 PM EST up reply actions
I am not a Kentucky fan, I am a "winning" fan
RP has not done anything in 11 years. I could care less about his personal life. And saying I am a UK fan because I am not behind Pitino is horseshit.
Time for new blood guys. Scott Drew, Brad Stevens, Chris Collins. Its time to get the process rolling. It is time to hold RP accountable. We are way too forgiving as a fanbase. That is why this is such a great job, and why we should expect more.
Man, at least 3 or 4 went into rebuilding this team.
Since 05
1FF
2EEs
- overall seed
Got the Yum Center for us
Set us in a position to succeed going forward.
Remember the Beef Bowl!
haha there's only one SEC program in the top 25
Florida at 19
by LouisvilleWarLord on Jan 12, 2012 4:14 PM EST reply actions
barely eeked one out today against TN
UK is FAR from invincible. Gonna love the early flame-out this year!
by twistedwedge on Jan 14, 2012 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
I see so many people going back and forth on this issue
Fire Pitino or Keep Pitino. Back and forth. Back and forth. Everyone has either lost faith and then five seconds later claim they will be at the game Saturday cheering. I mean, seriously? Make up your freaking mind and make a decision. Ya’ll sound like Skip Bayless drooling over Tebow. He loves him but doesn’t believe he can beat Brady. If you believe in somebody, some team, then freaking say I BELIEVE and don’t jump ship after a rocky period. Freaking fairweather fans.
Just checking in to see how this thread's go--OH MY GOD
by Mike Rutherford on Jan 12, 2012 4:59 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
ok first off..way to many mentions of uk in this post bro
if you are comparing your school to uk in basketball ..just stop.. funny how people always want to put a certain time limit or say well if u took out this guy’s coaching years…blah blah blah ..uk is better in basketball period…done deal no arguing that,,,NOW louisville on the other hand has the all around better sports program with sucess in mutilple sports..uk focuses on basketball first and then gives football the leftovers..just how it is …they know uk fans want basketball to be main focus..louisville is a multi-sports school and i think thats awesome..its one of the two things im envious of louisville for…the other is charlie strong… point is in the last 10 years uk has had 3 coaches while louisville has had 1 and still they have had the better go…time for pitino to go guys… throw a ton of money at brad stevens and get ur basketball program really rocking
I'm sick of fans who think they are owed wins and championships
Look, people, the kids are out there trying their best to win games. Some of them are hoping to go on to play pro ball, some not, but all of them want to win. That’s why they play the game, that’s why they chose to come to UofL. I want them to win too, just as much as you do; but I want it for their sake, not mine. I don’t give a flying fart what UK fans are going to say at the water cooler. When the Cardinals win, I celebrate with them. When they lose, I am disappointed for them, not disappointed in them or feeling they have let me down.
I’m distressed at what is happening to this team. But I’m more distressed and utterly disgusted by some of the stuff I hear coming from the fan base.
Seeing the Cards lose to teams they should handle easily is painful. It makes me ache for them. But they don’t owe me a damned thing, and they don’t owe you either – no matter how much yo pay for your season tickets and your access to the booster club and VIP parking. If you aren’t going to root for them through the hard times, we’ll all be better off if you just give up your season tickets and go root for someone who will win at all costs. I’m sure you can find someone like that in close proximity to UofL, probably within 80 miles or so.
I will support our players as long as they wear the Cardinal uniform. I will support Pitino as long as he remains our coach, and when he goes, I will support his successor. In the meantime, Go Cards!
"I am willing to donate to the charity that is working on the prevention of whatever the hell Dick Vitale has." - noobmaster
by rickmbari on Jan 12, 2012 5:12 PM EST reply actions 11 recs
getting rid of a coach that probably isnt going to make it out of the first weekend in the tourney
(if u make it) isnt “winning at all cost” its doing whats best for your basketball team and the fans who spend their hard earned money on tickets and louisville gear… a team with no heart does not deserve good praises
Yeah, you must be right
A team with three players who sacrificed scholarships has no heart.
A team that has fought through more injuries than any other team EVER has no heart.
A team that has a player logging 50 minutes in an overtime game when he has a MCL sprain has no heart.
Listen, this team has some major problems, and they hit rock bottom on Tuesday when they DID flat out quit. But one game does not make a season and I can assure THIS TEAM HAS FUCKING HEART.
by Ellis from Compton on Jan 12, 2012 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
"disappointed for them, not in them"
perfectly said. It’s refreshing to read someone else describe my feelings so precisely. Thanks, Rick!
PS: Remember “Little Yummer Boy?” That sure feels like a different season, doesn’t it?
by BostonCardFan on Jan 12, 2012 6:15 PM EST up reply actions
What is this Little Yummer Boy of which you speak?
"I am willing to donate to the charity that is working on the prevention of whatever the hell Dick Vitale has." - noobmaster
I agree wholeheartedly, but don't lose faith in people.
One must remember that for the most part this place is full of good people. There are going to be sour grapes in every bunch, and further there are going to be kids on here that haven’t learned what it is to be humbled.
by Justin Gingey Smith on Jan 12, 2012 6:21 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly. Thanks Rick, you speak for most of us.
And I would be MORE than happy to take those overpriced season tickets off their hands.
The coaching staff certainly does owe something to the fans, and wins and championships are part of that equation
And there are millions of reasons why that is the case. If it were otherwise, Steve Kragthorpe would still be coaching our beloved Cardinals, and there would be no Charlie Strong at Louisville. Kragthorpe was fired precisely because fans expect wins and championships, and our players and fanbase are both the better for it.
I am not a “fire Pitino” advocate, and plenty of criticism of CRP is unfair and unreasonable. But my allegiance to him is not blind, and it never will be for any head coach. Most of the criticism that I hear on this board is directed toward him, not the players. And some of it is certainly fair and warranted, and voicing that criticism does not equate with lack of support for our team.
by cardsinindy2010 on Jan 12, 2012 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
Good point. The kids are unpaid and playing for the team, where the coaches are very well paid and expected to produce results.
by Carolina Cardinal on Jan 12, 2012 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
Well, I could go further
For the privilege of playing basketball at the University of Louisville, representing the university by wearing the uniform, and playing in front of 20,000 fans, I expect maximum effort from our players. It isn’t unreasonable for fans to expect that, and I don’t think that is too much to ask.
As for fan criticism, playing high-level Division I basketball means that you receive incredible adulation, but also that you are sometimes subject to intense criticism. It is a “bitter with the sweet” kind of thing.
Now there are personal attacks that go beyond the line of acceptable or fair criticism, and that is true for criticism of both coaches and players. And it is unfair to expect more from our players than their best effort. But we don’t live in a world where fans only celebrate their players’ strengths without every discussing or analyzing their weaknesses, and that is really for the best. I don’t think most of us, including the players, would want it any other way.
by cardsinindy2010 on Jan 12, 2012 7:58 PM EST up reply actions
"We have kids that go to school for 4 years, play hard, and have lives after basketball and become better men."
Great quote. That’s what the heart and soul of NCAA basketball is supposed to be about. It shouldn’t be about finding the best high school player in the country every year so they can take you to the Final Four and immediately go to the NBA. I think we could get some more solid recruits, but I am fine with who we have. I dare you to find a more humble and honest guy than Kyle Kuric.
Calipari is a cop out who only looks out for himself. He doesn’t care about the University of Kentucky…he cares about his basketball program and nothing more.
UofL is the best public college in the state of Kentucky. Every single one of our sporting teams are awesome at what they do. In the large scheme of things, Louisville is more well rounded and smarter than Kentucky could ever wish to be.
by IronWolfFirm on Jan 12, 2012 5:44 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
YES. THIS.
I actually missed that quote the first time — and as I wrote above to rickmbari, it’s super-refreshing to read someone else describe my feelings so precisely.
Thanks, willscottonfire, for writing it — and thanks, IronWolf, for calling my attention to it.
GO CARDS.
by BostonCardFan on Jan 12, 2012 6:18 PM EST up reply actions
This post makes me feel better.
Hear! Hear!
by OwsleyCountyCard on Jan 12, 2012 6:24 PM EST reply actions
Hahahahaha
Fool's names are like their faces, often seen in public places.
Follow @ChickStratino
by Chick-Stratino'sUrDaddy on Jan 12, 2012 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
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