The Good, The Bad, And The Kragtastic
by CardsFan922 on Sep 27, 2009 7:37 PM EDT
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PrintWell that sucked. Excitement abounded before the kick-off, and predictions of victory flew from unlikely corners (even frankpos thought we had a chance!). The beginning of the game probably improved frankpos's optimism: Chris Campa introduced himself to the Utah crowd and the home team with a big hit on the kick-off, and LD Scott got the team's first sack of the season on the first play from scrimmage. After forcing a three-and-out, the offense marched down the field: Scott Long made good on the pre-game angle from the CJ and beat his man for a 23-yard gain on the first play. More positive plays resulted in first and goal from the 8. The game thread got positively giddy: most were pretty quick to get excited and hop back on the bandwagon with both feet.
Everyone knows what happened next. But sulking wasn't doing it for me, so I thought I'd dive back in to the game and the post-game quotes and put together the good, the bad, and the Kragtastic. Join me? ....after the jump...
The Good
- First and foremost, Chris Campa came to play. The oft-overlooked linebacker set the tone with a big hit on the opening kickoff, and then continued to lay the wood. And although I can't find for sure how many tackles he ended up with, it was a lot and all of them seemed like big hits.
- Scott Long is talented. As was discussed during the game thread, hopefully he gets a chance to prove himself at the next level because his college career has been limited by Harry Douglas/Mario, injury and Kragthorpe.
- The Defense as a unit played generally well: it held Utah to 4-13 on third downs and kept Utah out of the end-zone in the second and third quarters. They got pressure on the QB and recorded three sacks, and Chaz Thompson had a nice pick that set up the first touchdown.
- Penalties were held down to a reasonably small amount, only 5 for 50 yards. Utah had 9 for 100 yards, including a couple that kept our drives going.
- Doug Beaumont had a couple nice plays, ending up with 4 catches for 87 yards. Does everyone realize he's already a JUNIOR? Sorry, this isn't the Kragtastic section.
- Cory Goettsche averaged 49 yards on punts, including a long of 57 yards. As Sam ruined the good vibes pointed out in the game thread, this may have had something to do with the thin air and the altitude. I choose to believe that he has figured out how to kick the ball farther and you can't prove it to me otherwise until the Pitt game.
The Bad
- Oy. Where to begin? How about the rushing game, which put up a whopping 80 yards on one of the worst run defenses in the country, one that gave up more than 200 yards to Utah State and Oregon.
- Vic, whose asthma may have been worsened by the thin air, was not himself, rushing for only 20 yards on 10 carries. He was outgained by Bilal Joseph Powell....by 2 yards, 22 total yards on 10 carries. Darius Ashley got in the game finally: he carried twice for six yards. Better average than the other two, anyway.
- The defense allowed 214 yards on the ground to a team who starting running out of running backs when their top two both went down with injuries during the game. The defense also allowed 202 yards in the air to a QB who really wasn't that impressive except for that perfect strike TD immediately following Guy's fumble.
- Any shred of confidence remaining in Trent Guy was obliterated after his fumble. I didn't see him on the field, he didn't get the ball thrown his way and he was pulled from both punts and kickoffs. Feel really bad for the kid.
- Lots of punts, as we ended up 4-14 on third down conversions.
- Burke completed less than 50% of his passes, threw an INT and had that weird play where he just sorta stood there in Vic's way on the hand-off.
- The red-zone offense relied on an awkward Burke run (Play No. 2, see below for full chart) and the craziest touchdown catch I've ever seen (Burke threw a No. 8 that turned into a No. 6 when the ball bounced off Scott Long into the waiting arms of CamGraham) for our only touchdowns, and failed to score on the opening drive, which was a huge momentum swing early in the game.
- The game just sorta sucked, was mostly boring, and the announcers were terrible.
The Kragtastic
- Mike pointed out in the game thread (do a ctl-F for "WE ONLY HAVE EIGHT PLAYS") that we only have eight plays. He may actually be correct:
- Run up the middle
- Burke drops back to pass, there's nothing there, Burke scrambles (probably our best play)
- Screen to the running back (every so often to the WR) - rarely works
- 3-step drop, quick jump ball to Scott Long
- Play-action rollout, Tronzo underneath, Beaumont at the next level.
- Whatever play that results in CamGraham open underneath or in the flat
- Reverse
- Slant to Scott Long
- Play No. 1 was not effective, and Krag was surprised in this morning's CJ:
They pressured a little bit more," said Kragthorpe, adding that the Cards had to abandon the run once they fell behind. "On first down they had some different inside linebacker dogs that they hadn't run a whole lot."
- Really? They were able to stop the run up the middle? We had 19 plays on first down, and by my count from the espn.com game chart, on 12 of those we ran the ball, more often than not up the middle. We had one play where we faked the FB dive and then pitched out, but it was covered nicely by Utah. But I don't remember many sweeps, many outside runs, misdirections, counters or play action on first down. I think they knew a No. 1 was coming more often than not on first down, and they ran a defense that countered it. That's some Kragtastic play-calling in the run game.
- While not going for two points ultimately didn't cost anything because we didn't score again and Utah did, that would seem to be coaching 101. You scored a touchdown that gets you down 10, the only way to make it a 1-possession game is to go for 2. Maybe Krag was so shocked we scored a TD even though he called a No. 8 that was a yard short of the first down and 12 yards away from the end zone, even if caught.
- Adam Froman played on special teams. I am not making this up. Burke had to limp off the field at one point, and Froman is coming back from injury. I really can't see any upside to doing this? Unless he was looking to test Will Stein.
- The overall awfulness that is Kragthorpe-coached Louisville football.
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Oh...
…how could I forget: sideline interference. What in the hell is that? Kragtastic, that’s what it is.
Froman and Ashley will transfer if Krag isn't fired, mark my words.
Froman may transfer either way.
Also, Ctrl-f for “Find” only works if you are on a PC. If you have a Mac, it’s Command-f. Just FYI.
I said this elsewhere but....
….if Kragthorpe can do the same thing over and over so can I.
I do appreciate the effort the players made last night. I want to leave my remarks about the players there and talk about coaching. Let me try to make my case that Kragthorpe is over his head with facts rather than emotion. Here are just a few examples from the Utah game that show a lack of coaching fundamentals and/or organizational skills.
1. As usual we cannot convert in the red zone where because of the shortness of the field good play calling is at a premium. Our two TD’s were the result of a busted play and a lucky ricochet. And of course we have a FG blocked to start the game.
2. Guy’s fumble was set up by him carrying the ball with his inside hand instead of outside as players are supposed to be coached to do. If he does this in games he does this in practices. He should be stopped and gently chided (or made to run forever) each time he does it in practice to break this bad habit but it appears the coaches don’t get it.
3. We get off a great punt with great coverage to pin Utah deep but don’t have enough men on the line. What?
4. We have to burn a time out before rekicking because we are confused.
5. We have a personal foul on the rekick costing us 15 yards. Are you aware that our % of penalties on special teams plays are three times that of regular plays. Why aren’t we practicing special teams? Or if we are why can’t anyone get it right?
6. We then have a miscommunication between the QB and RB costing five yards (pattern coming ).
7. Burn a timeout to avoid delay of game.
8. QB and RB collide (here’s the pattern).
9. QB and RB are on two different plays yet again (don’t you think game three is a little late to still be learning the plays?)
10. Delay of game penalty on the defense? When was the last time you heard that one?
11. Utah’s last drive featured a wide receiver screen to the right flat for a big gain. Two plays later the same play worked great to the left. See a pattern our coaches didn’t? Several plays later the same play back to the right for another big gain. Hmm, pattern getting sharper? And then in a total surprise Utah runs it again to the left with success. How can we get burned four times in one possession by the same play? Give the coaches the first five letters and they couldn’t spell adjustment.
We are not prepared to play winning football. It’s like watching a comedy team of Bob Weber and Ron Cooper.
The Kragtastic list looks short,
but I don’t want to relive that madness by recalling everything that went wrong.
Oh, but wait, there are some things I can’t forget.
1. The 2-point attempt (or lack of). You mentioned it, but I really cannot get over it. To me, it was more than just an oversight; it was a message to the players that we weren’t interested in playing to win the game. I am probably overstating it a bit, but I wonder if the lay down we had on the next defensive stand wasn’t a sign of the players deciding to give up too.
2. Not going for it on 4th and 19 with 4 minutes to go while down 16. Same exact thing. Yes, I realize that we have a 2% chance of converting, and we would give up perfect field position. But punting gave us a 1% chance of keeping the ball and a 0% chance of winning. Again, it’s like we didn’t want to win.
3. Everything just looked sloppy. For example, Burke had at least 2 plays where he and the running back were just on completely different pages, and neither time did Burke seem to know how to react. No sense of urgency from anybody.
Someone needs to take this idea and run with it
by Mike Rutherford on Sep 27, 2009 10:07 PM EDT reply actions
I can go all day, Koach...
please get your hands off my beloved football team. Please.
by quiet cardinal on Sep 28, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions
I saw a shirt in the student section at the ISU game
On the front it had an obamicon of Kragthorpe. Instead of “Hope” it said “Nope”.
On the back it had “Kragthorpe’s Farewell Tour 2009” and listed the UofL schedule.
I think the guy said he got it at grateful threads or somewhere like that.
DocCardsFan
The 'Ville, KY
Yep
Believe it or not I was still giving Kragthorpe the benefit of the doubt until last night. The defense looks like they know what they’re doing. Everyone seems to know what defense they’re in and players are in position. We just lack talent and depth.
The offense, however, looks confused and alone. Kinda like a lost dog. Players on 2 different plays, fumbled snaps, just general confusion. Despite having the most talent and depth on the team, the offensive unit is the worst on the team.
Coaching has to be the answer. Kragthorpe’s MO is offense and he’s the man in charge of that unit. I’m tired of watching disorganized football on Saturdays.
Now I fear this: The only person in this entire state that has an ego bigger than Rick Pitino is Tom Jurich. I’m afraid Jurich is going to keep Kragthorpe next year because he is certain he knows better than the fans, media, fans of other teams, and pretty much everyone else that has ever seen us play. I’m afraid the only certain way to make sure a coaching change happen is to stay away. I’ve already got a $15 ticket for Friday night but that will probably be the only game I go to this season. Seeing that new section of stands half empty next season will all but force Jurich to do something. The cry from donors and alums will be deafening, if it already isn’t.
Crawford mentioned it in his blog
Many UL fans upset. Quoted the reason that Krag gave (which was dumb), and then brushed it off as good enough for him. Whatever.
Proof that nobody cared about this game.
The AP obviously got one of the iterns to put the shots together who did it while drinking heavily.
Two point conversion
I am by no means a Kragthorpe apologist, quite the contrary actually, but I have to defend the two point conversion decision. In 2007 (the most recent numbers I can find), two point tries were successfully converted less than 50% of the time (107/254, .421). At that point in the game, two successful two pointers would be needed to merely tie the game. Converting one of the two is unlikely, according to those numbers, and two of two is statistically very improbable. By kicking the PAT, the team was in a position to need a touchdown and field goal to take the lead, and with nearly nine minutes to go in the game, this was still a decent possibility. If you go for two and don’t make it, a touchdown and field goal now only ties the game. I’m all for going for two if it doesn’t cause any harm, but in that situation, it means the difference between a two possession game for the lead or the tie. I know it seems like throwing in the towel, but I believe in that instance, he actually made the better call.
by Cool Hand Cards on Sep 27, 2009 11:48 PM EDT reply actions
It was 23-13 :
1) If we go for 2 and convert it that makes it 23-15, which is a 8 point game. This makes it a one possession game. Seeing how the game was going, I think we all would take the odds that we may only get the ball in the end zone one more time at that point.
2) If we go for 2 and miss it, the score is 23-13. 10 Point game, 2 possessions. Like I said before, the way the game had gone, 2 scoring drives was improbable. We would need a TD (which would be needed in scenario 1) as well as a field goal.
3). We go for one and convert, the score is 23-14. 9 point game. Still a 2 possession game. Again we need a TD like in #1 and #2, but not we win the game on the converted field goal. If we had Art, maybe I would see this option, but with our so-so kicking, I just don’t trust it.
Looking at the way the game was going, I would have tried to get the score withing a one possession game. In either scenario of 2 and 3 we would have tied or won (if we got the ball in scoring position 2 more times).
-Dustin
I guess basically what I'm trying to get at...
is why not go for the two? If you miss it or just go for the PAT you have to have a TD and a field goal to tie or win the game. If it came down to that, I don’t think any of us would complain to have to try to win it in overtime. I just don’t think many of us thought we would get 2 more chances to make that even happen.
-Dustin
Exactly.
In a game where you’re an underdog, you have to take chances and put your team in a position to win or at least extend the game. This is why nobody had a problem with going for it on 4th down in the UK game, we were just flabbergasted by the option call.
Those stats are a bit misleading...
I realize that the average conversion rate for a 2P conversion is below 50%, but that just doesn’t justify the decision.
We’ve scored TDs on 8 of 37 possessions this year. We’ve kicked a FG 8 times. Add in the turnover on downs, and picks in what I think would have been FG range, and you’ve got 19 of 37 possessions where we moved into position to kick a field goal. That’s also ignoring that some of those possessions in FG range were set up by TOs in our territory, and not the offense moving the ball down the field like they probably would have had to against Utah. So the math goes something like this (correct me if I’m wrong):
1) Odds of scoring one more TD and getting both 2P conversions: (8/37)x(.42)*(42) = .038. Basically, from a statistical standpoint, we had a 4% chance of pulling off the strategy that any sane football coach would favor.
2) Odds of scoring a 2P conversion, a TD (+XP), and a 2P conversion: (8/37)(.42)(19/37)*(.625) = .29. That means we had a 3% chance of getting it Krag’s way. If you factor in that Payne is only 3/7 in his career from outside 30 yards, that number falls below 2%. Account for the fact that our offense actually moved the ball into FG range on fewer than 19 possessions and it gets even worse.
There are innumerable other factors that make needing two possessions in the last 8 minutes of the 4th quarter a bad idea, but those are just some raw numbers that further prove the decision was retarded. Not to mention that if going for two wasn’t the absolutely correct thing to do, then it wouldn’t be standard protocol for every other coach in the game. These guys (with the obvious exception of Koach) spend an unthinkable amount of time analyzing every little detail of every single minute aspect of every strategic decision they make. If going for two there wasn’t the thing to do, they probably wouldn’t almost universally agree that it was.
by _TheGainesShow_ on Sep 28, 2009 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Good work, but you are being too generous.
Kragthorpe’s rationalization for not going for 2 was that we needed to get an on-sides kick, so you need to factor in the on-sides kick that would have been needed to get 2 more possessions in the last 8 minutes (when they were due to receive the ball). On-sides kicks are successful less than 20% of the time, and we haven’t recovered one successfully since Krag has been here. In fact, I remember our attempts against Syracuse and I think Utah, and they were abysmal.
Also, while we are 8/37 on scores during the season (42%), we were 2/11 on drives against Utah up until that point (3/11 if you consider the first drive where we at least got within field goal range). That’s 18 or 27% success rate against the team we were playing, which is obviously more relevant that our stats against ISU or UK.
And then there’s the psychology of sending a message to your players that you haven’t given up and are playing to win the game.
I knew I was forgetting something
Even though I think it proved the point, I knew those numbers looked way to close when I was done with them. I just couldn’t figure out what I was leaving out.
Here’s another thing I just thought of that I haven’t seen mentioned on here or in any of the other threads on ITV and the like. If we were down 8, and they kicked a FG, it’s still only a TD + 2P + FG to tie. Sure, its unlikely that we could get those, especially when you factor in the onside kick. However, if we’re down 9 and they kicked a FG, then we need two TDs to win. Clearly none of this mattered, but the more I think about it, the more pissed off I get about the whole thing.
by _TheGainesShow_ on Sep 29, 2009 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I really can't get over it.
It’s no so much the bad decision – that happens – but the message. I feel like Kragthorpe doesn’t even care anymore. I know it’s getting harder for me to care.
we should also mention the message it sends to the Defense
and the possible momentum gained if the conversion works…momentum the team needed to have any shot at winning this game.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 28, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions
I disagree as well with all the various excellent points
Every other coach in America goes for 2 there.
Consolation: You didn't drive 12 hours roundtrip to watch this crap
I only saw one other Louisville fan at the very impressive Rice-Eccles Stadium and it was slightly bizarre b/c everyone was wearing red and white. The Ute fans very nervous after the first few plays on our opening possession but after the blocked FG, they captured the momentum and never worried about the outcome the rest of the way.
There was no alcohol being sold inside the stadium but in gestures of pity more than sportsmanship, plenty of Utah fans offered up their snuck-in whiskey-based concoctions as the game progressed. Unless its bourbon, no thanks mesays. I was having so much fun, I left in the middle of the 4th quarter, checked out of my hotel and drove 6 hours back home.
I didn’t wake up the next day with a hangover but I do feel Kragthorpe’d
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 28, 2009 1:04 AM EDT reply actions
Yes, during the game there was a big difference from Papa John's
But there was plenty of tailgating going on prior to the game, some of which may be attributed to the homecoming angle. I walked back to my car during halftime and there were many drunken, befuddled fans stumbling around the tailgating area, including a 40-something year old woman who was passed out on a sidewalk. As I walked past her, the husband (I hope) pulled up in his car and literally dragged her into the passenger seat.
I underestimated you, Utah football drinking scene…much respect.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 28, 2009 1:22 AM EDT up reply actions
LMAO
UL Football Fan/UK Basketball Fan ~ Okinawa, Japan
by The White Mandingo on Sep 28, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Tailgating here has become pretty big.
What you saw is typical of the experience.
You’ve got to remember that many Ute fans are not stereotypical Utahns. That’s why our fanbase is great because we have a mix of Mormon and non-Mormon fans and they generally don’t clash.
Lots of drinking, though.
Glad you had fun here. I might be going down to Vegas for the Utes-UNLV game next month.
I'm going to that UNLV game too
the Rebels are getting better. I couldn’t stand watching them a couple seasons ago.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 30, 2009 1:49 AM EDT up reply actions
It's one step forward, two steps back with their program.
They had a bowl berth locked up last year heading into their final game of the season against a 1-10 SDSU team and then lost.
Mike Sanford is a bad coach. I’m sure you know he was the OC at Utah during the 2003 and 2004 seasons. But the guy just doesn’t get it.
oh
and I wouldn’t say it was “fun” but I did respect the atmosphere. Not SLC’s fault though.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 30, 2009 1:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Well you know what I mean!
Yes, I doubt it was fun watching your team lose. I should say, I’m glad you weren’t brutally murdered while here. ;)
The good: The City of Louisville
Took a trip to your fine city this weekend for a buddy’s bachelor party and had a grand ol’ time. Special mention to, uh, “Destinee” at PT’s…
The bad: Losing $100 on the Cards +14.
Kragtastic: Northwest Airlines.
You ain't hurt.
Northwest is sooo Kragtastic
Glad you had a good time.
by Mike Rutherford on Sep 28, 2009 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I think we only have 7 plays
Play #2, the one we run the best, is really only a derivative of the total failure of our handful of passing plays. I wouldn’t put it past kragthorpe to put in a play by which receivers are told to not get open, with the whole idea being Burke will run the ball after 8 seconds or so.
After 8 seconds?
We haven’t had that long to throw all year
by sam34gtr on Sep 28, 2009 10:30 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You got me there
It just feels more drawn out to me do the incredible sense of pain i now feel during each and every play.
I am so soured on football
Soured man. Pissed off. Disgusted. Embarassed. Ashamed. Krackpipe has me hating football. I want to chew his feet off. Arghhh.
Go Cards!
utah fans
they are the best. a guy posted earlier of them offering snuck in whiskey to him. I sat next to them when they came here two year ago. met about 10-15 ute fans who were all cool. old guys cussing like sailors throwin down booze. it was fun.
The Good: The First 3 minutes of the game
The Bad: The rest of the game
The Kragtastic: Vic Anderson 10 carries, No 2-pt conversion ( it did matter, it would have built momentum and the defense would have been more amped to stop Utah on the next possesion)
Turnovers in the first quarter
by Cambroni Cardinals on Sep 28, 2009 1:19 PM EDT reply actions
Yep, hard to hate the Utes
Great fans who loved the game and drank judicially enough to have fun whilst not offending the large number of children in the stands. Reminded me of…high school basketball?
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 29, 2009 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Noob here
I’ve gotten so frustrated with Kragthorpe football that I feel the need to start letting off some steam.
1. Why pull Trent Guy from returns? The only way players can learn is by doing, and whatever little confidence he had remaining was destroyed by pulling him. I only hope he can find a way to overcome it.
2. These stupid penalties have to stop. I thought it couldn’t get much worse than breaking from a timeout with 12 men on the field, but defensive delay of game? Every game I am constantly amazed at the ways in which Kragthorpe finds to sabotage this team.
Trent who?
I was under the impression that I couldn’t freakin’ talk about the “player that can’t be talked about”
by UL is my hot hot sex on Sep 29, 2009 2:00 AM EDT up reply actions
The Peter Principle
Years ago a business writer/philosopher came up with The Peter Principle which boiled down to the nitty gritty says a competent person will be promoted to the level at which he becomes incompetent. Kragthorpe has reached that level. But I bet he can’t find his peter.
Jurich
must have Beer Kragoggles on not to see what he is doing out there. Please after this season end the misery!
UL Football Fan/UK Basketball Fan ~ Okinawa, Japan
by The White Mandingo on Sep 28, 2009 6:39 PM EDT reply actions
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