Big 10 to expand to 12? Louisville a possible candidate?
by rickmbari on Dec 15, 2009 2:48 PM EST
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PrintIt's widely reported that the Big 10 will have a press conference at 3 PM today to make an announcement regarding possible expansion to 12 teams. Louisville is one of six or eight schools being tossed around as possible targets. Others include Notre Dame, Rutgers, Syracuse, Cincinnati, Missouri, Nebraska, and IUPUI (just kidding about that last one).
I think it's pretty easy to guess that the Big Ten will indeed seek a twelfth member, in order to get the bucks involved in a football championship game. The two questions that are not as easily answered are: (1) will they extend an offer to the Cardinals, and (2) would Louisville accept such an offer?
I have always thought that the Big Ten or the SEC would have been a more natural fit geographically for U of L than the Big East. However, we only just joined the latter a couple of years ago, and I'm not sure how I'd feel about jumping to yet another conference. We seem to have been jumping around a lot since the MVC days when I was a kid. there was the Metro, then C-USA, and now the Big East... would we be well advised to make yet another jump?
The Big Ten is certainly a better football conference, and might offer Coach Strong a recruiting advantage over the BE. But the Big East is such a basketball powerhouse, I hate to think about breaking it up.
Would the Big Ten wants us? All I can say is that if I were the Big Ten, I'd want us badly. Under Jurich, we've reached an incredible level of across-the-board success. We're the only team this century to make both men's and women's Final Fours, the CWS, and a BCS bowl. We are strong in several other sports including tennis, golf, women's volleyball, cheerleading and dance team. Our fans travel well and would support any conference tournaments, playoffs, etc., in the major sports.
I need to end this post before 3:00 gets here, or it may all be moot - they could actually announce expansion and name the new school at the presser. In the meantime, what do you think about the possibilities?
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Wow
Whenever I heard about the expansion I thought that it would come at the cost of the Big East. I would hate to see Pitt or Notre Dame go. I never thought about them targeting Louisville.
I don’t think we’d be interested in jumping this quickly, and I love Big East Basketball, but I would be excited if we did join the Big 10.
Notre Dame
I would love to see ND go. Like now! It is disgusting that they want to reap all of the benefits of the BE but not play BE football. They have the classic “have their cake and eat it too” at present and that cake makes me want to throw up.
Get all the way in or all the way out. This just a little bit pregnant sucks!
reap all the benefits....
actually ND is a reason that the BE still has some decent bowl ties. When the Big East split and Miami, BC, etc left for the ACC, the Big East needed ND to help secure some bowls. THat why many of the bowls are “3rd BE team or ND”
by Ben Go CARDS on Dec 16, 2009 8:57 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I hate ND with a passion and love to see them lose.
But they are a benefit to BE football, no matter what some fans think about it. They get something out of it too, but we shouldn’t be so quick to dismiss them (and there is a reason why the ADs have no interest in forcing ND out).
Now I'm rethinking things
I hope the Big East doesn’t collapse. I think we have strong rivalries with urban institutions, I like to cheer for urban institutions when they’re not playing UofL. I don’t know how I’d feel about UofL playing Michigan, Ohio State, Indiana, Penn State, et cetera at the cost of playing Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, and Georgetown. I would much rather see the Big East pull in Memphis, and have all the teams currently in the league play well again.
That being said, if the Big East is collapsing, let’s get out. Big 10 sounds good.
Corrections
There is no press conference, and the announcement will be made at 3 PM CST.
Lack of a presser clearly means there’s no major announcement like naming a new member, or probably even a definite statement that the conference will expand. Sources say it will be a year or a year and a half before they make the decision on whether or not to add a twelfth member. Which gives us ample time to discuss the pros and cons from their side and from ours.
Pitt's the logical choice
I’m really interested to see how this plays out. It’s not a secret that most people associated with the Big East are not happy with the current football setup.
by Mike Rutherford on Dec 15, 2009 4:11 PM EST reply actions
No freaking way
Louisville bolts the Big East. Way too much basketball advantage. Think of all the big markets involved. Give that up for what, Columbus Ohio and Ann Arbor, Michigan? Not gonna happen.
U of L only goes
If the ACC or SEC come calling.
by Mike Rutherford on Dec 15, 2009 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think it matters much because we are an unlikely target (I think).
However, the potential profit might be hard to turn down if we turn out to be a viable contender. The best numbers I can find indicate that Big 10 teams come in 2nd in average football revenue at about $25,000,000 per school (several years ago) (compared to about $10,000,000 per Big East school) Granted, a lot of that money might be tied to attendance and tickets, but there’s no dispute that they have a better television deal and conference sharing arrangement than the Big East. They have the Rose Bowl, and under the current BCS configeration, are going to send a 2nd BCS team more years than not. Plus, this doesn’t even include the money that will be made by having the conference championship game.
As for ticket sales, I think IU is a natural rival for obvious reasons (imagine having Crean back to hate), and I suspect that we won’t have trouble selling out games against OSU or Michigan, or even PSU, even with the expanded stadium.
How would Jurich turn down $10,000,000 per year?
And how much do we want to stay in the Big East if we lose Pitt, Rutgers, or WVU to the Big 10 only to replace them with ??? Memphis? Yikes.
Granted, I love basketball in the Big East, and I love the football rivalries with WVU and UC, but our basketball will always be fine (even in C-USA), and I wouldn’t mind losing the football rivalries for a shot at OSU or Michigan every year.
Agreed
Personally, I like the Big East. Our other sports are thriving in it, but we just haven’t had the nationally significant football matchups lately that the Big 10 (now 11, soon to be 12) would bring. Bball would take a hit though. I love our basketball league and the BE tournament. I think it would be a wash for the University to make the move. It improves football, but detracts from basketball.
DocCardsFan
The 'Ville, KY
I'm bettin' the Big Ten opts for Rutgers
They want that New York market.
theoldman
Rutgers or Missouri I think
Someone asked Jerry Palm on twitter if U of L was an option and he said no because PJS is too small. So that would have to apply to Cincinnati as well. Pitt seems very logical.
60k is too small?
Damn that’s nuts. We live in a bubble here in the states, just for an idea, 3 of the top 6 largest sports (not racing) stadiums in the WORLD are in the Big 10. The only stadiums larger than Happy Valley, the Big House and OSU are some shit in North Korea, a Cricket ground in India, and the stadium that Mexico’s national team plays in.
Further context: The smallest stadiums in the Big 10 currently are N’Western, Indiana, Minnesota and Illinois, all of which would be smaller than PJCS once expansion is complete. Not saying that we should go to the Big 10, it doesn’t seem like a good fit, but Jerry Palm saying that PJCS is too small is just incorrect.
How could he say that when.....
after the expansion PJCS will seat more than to of there current teams ( Northwestern, Indiana ),,,,, And with the millions of more dollars football would be bringin in im sure another 20,000 seat expansion would in the works to get us up around the 70,000 to 75,000 seat mark…. And lets not foget how we filled PJCS during the Petrino era…. So we know how to fill a stadium just give us a good product on the feild
Agreed
the guy hasn’t done his research
UL Football Fan/UK Basketball Fan ~ Okinawa, Japan
by The White Mandingo on Dec 15, 2009 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
Louisville in the Big Ten (12) > Louisville in the Big East
Football situation would improve more than basketball situation would decline.
I think a Big Ten (12) Louisville program would schedule more interesting non-conference games against the likes of UCLA, Texas, Kansas, UNC and still keep some of the better rivalry games going with Big East teams like West Virginia, UC and Notre Dame every now and then. The conference play would be weaker from top to bottom thus allowing for more exciting non-conference scheduling and therefore, more exposure in those markets with regards to recruiting. The only Western exposure UofL has currently is in Las Vegas…and basketball people here hate Pitino b/c he burned UNLV back in 2001 to come to L’ville and their High School kids tend to stay on the West Coast for college ball anyways.
But like Mike said, I don’t see Louisville moving unless it’s to the ACC or SEC.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Dec 15, 2009 5:03 PM EST reply actions
Only thing I disagree with there
is the OOC scheduling getting more exciting. UofL hasn’t played an outstanding non-conference schedule since Pitino has been here, even in the C-USA days. Only notable mentions I remember was the home-home deal with Florida for two seasons, and one season versus Indiana. Kentucky doesn’t really count because that game is a must. The state demands it. Personally, I don’t think Pitino would have it every year if it wasn’t a ‘rule’. There were two home-home deals with Tennessee, but they were not the team they’ve molded into with Pearl. Other than that, we’ve played Iowa twice and Arizona once.
Pitino just doesn’t like an exciting OOC schedule. His idea of an “extremely difficult” OOC run is against Arkansas, UNLV, and Western KY. Pre-season, he spoke of that trek like it was a top 10 gauntlet. Meanwhile, down the road Kentucky always plays UNC and IN, had a home-home with Kansas, Duke one year, Mich St another, Memphis, and so on. That’s an exciting schedule for their fans to look forward to.
Now, granted we just can’t seem to beat mid-major teams early in the season so big-time rivalries with the likes of UCLA, Texas, Mich St, and/or IN (when they return to form) aren’t logical and would only lead to embarrassment. But, if Pitino could manage a strong season from start to finish like in 2004-05 we’d have some major excitement with OOC matchups like that.
But, as it is, Rick just doesn’t dig dancin’ until conference play and March.
________________________________________________
~LK
www.myspace.com/lordkayoss
www.youtube.com/lordkayossrippro
www.welcometomynightmare.tk
true...
but I’m also assuming Rick will be gone within 3-5 yrs, so as a long term move, it works I think. If the Big East were to collapse, the ACC would be a better fit though; I can’t see the SEC being interested.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Dec 16, 2009 12:14 AM EST up reply actions
The only reason we would jump
(if given the opportunity) would be the football money. I really am bored with Big 10 football though. I never watch any of those games. None of the teams are exciting to watch. The style is not that interesting. I know Big East football isn’t quite as developed, but I think it’s more fun, fresh, young, and exciting. For us BE makes sense because the basketball is just awesome and we are a basketball school. Plus we are well represented in minor sports and BE fits us for that. Big 10 basketball is only interesting with MSU and Purdue (on occassion OSU). But the best reason not to join is I don’t think we should associate with the Midwest. Just my opinion but Big East has better connotations. Mike is right. I think SEC or ACC would be the only way we should go, but I don’t see any of those happening any time soon. I’m happy with the BE right now. Also, I can’t stand championship conference games in college football. Just another way to make money off a game that’s often not needed. Plus it can sometimes screw the conference out of a BCS game.
Maddie in Portland, Oregon
I'd like to play Michigan State twice every year in hoops.
Maximizes opportunities to avenge last year’s debacle.
by cardsinindy2010 on Dec 15, 2009 5:10 PM EST reply actions
If the Big Ten offers, Louisville should jump at the chance. It’s a less trying basketball league that still has great stature. As for football, it’s infinitely better. The BIg East looks wobbly and the Big Ten would give the Cards a serious recruiting benefit. Not to mention, other than OSU and Michigan, the football league is fairly easy.
Big Ten in a heartbeat.
I think the Big East gets a lot of press for how hard it is
But make no mistake, the Big 10 basketball was a meat grinder last year too. I think it’d be easier to play in the ACC or Pac-10, where no one’s trying to kill you every game than in the Big 10 where teams live on physicality.
I think this would be a great move for us.....
Could you imagine Ohio St , Michigan or Penn St coming to town…. We would actually be able to keep a good coach around for a while because lets face it the big east is losing ground when it comes to football… No matter how we look at it, going and playing Cincinnatti at cincy in front of 35,000 on a good saturday wouldnt compare to playing ohio state in the horeshoe in front of 105,000….. And no the big ten doestnt compare to the big east as far as basketball goes but its still a decent league….It would make for an interesting battle between Izzo and Pitino year in and year out….
Also if this happens and say they choose PITT.....
The BIG EAST would likely loose its status as a BCS CONFERENCE ….. because that would take us down to 7 teams…. yea they could probably fill the spot with a C-USA team but I think the perception of many analyst is that we should have our BCS tag removed anyway and losing one of our better teams might solidify that
We have as much a chance at joining the Big 10 as Bellarmine
All 10 11 schools are members of the Association of American Universities, and they’re really proud of that. Guess who’s not in with those “cool schools”? Pitt, Syracuse, and SUNJ are the BE schools that are “in”. Missouri, Nebraska, Kansas, and Iowa State fit as well. Interestingly, Notre Dame is not a member.
Acdemia identity is one of their concerns too
I agree with you. Look at those big-10 schools, they have similar academia background. Pitt and Rutgers share similar status. Louisville has a large distance from them.
Missouri is the obvious choice geographically
Columbia is a college town like the rest of the Big Ten schools. They are the biggest game in town, but they have fans in a large media market in St Louis. I think they could step in and be competitive in basketball and football. Just put the schools west of the Wabash river in the western division and there you have it.
to hell with the big ten! keep the big east going. we dont need to change conferences, we need to make it stronger. tell notre dame join in football or get the hell out in everything else. nobody can touch the big east in b-ball. when the big east loses its automatic bcs bid, than we should shop around, until than to hell with everybody else, they come in and steal the coaches, lets not let them take our teams!
by ville 606 on Dec 16, 2009 5:33 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Just to make it more interesting
What if the Big 10 takes Missouri, and then Arkansas leaves the SEC for the Big 12? The SEC would be looking.
Of course, I think all of this is extremely unlikely. I worry that Pitt or Rutgers will leave the Big East (and they should go if invited), and we will see our justification as a BCS conference shrink.
NOT the SEC...
Oh for God’s sake.. .NOT the SEC. It’s a personal thing that I won’t go into here, but I LOATHE, repeat LOATHE, every team, every school, every coach and every player that is currently, has ever or will ever play any sport in that conference.
Not that big a fan of the Big 10 11 10
I’m thinking the Big East is quite challenging enough.
Grog
"There is no OFF position to the genius switch" - D. Letterman
SEC sucks
compared to the Big East in basketball. Why the hell would we want to make that jump? Sure, football is better, but the basketball loss wouldn’t be worth it.
by REALISTICCARDSFAN on Dec 16, 2009 10:47 AM EST reply actions
The Big Ten is an *academic* association
Or at least the CIC (Big Ten + Chicago) is. Shared library spending, tuition reciprocation, etc. There is no way UofL gets an invite. UofL and Cincy are being mentioned so that when whichever of Rutgers, Syracuse, or maybe Pitt, goes, we have less of a high horse to get on because we will have already admitted behind closed doors that we would go if asked.
I only see two scenarios where this doesn’t affect us. (1) Nobody goes, because B10 decides not to ask, or somebody gets asked and turns them down. (2) They go for Missouri and the B12 gets TCU instead of Arkansas.
The big problem is not whether we want to be in the B10. The big problem is how we deal with the loss of Rutgers, Cuse, or Pitt. (Nova upgrade? Memphis? UCF? FAU? Army/Navy? Notre Dame blackmail? Superconference with the Mountain West? Ugh.)
East Carolina or Nova upgrade
Villanova is in the FBS Championship game this weekend, time for them to make a UCONN-esque move up to the big boy division. I’d rather have East Carolina though.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Dec 16, 2009 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is The Big East has.......
to many schools that arent division football programs ( Georgetown, Villinova, St. Johns, Ston Hall, Marquette, Providence and depaul ) so its hard to add schools because of all the basketball schools we already have…..The Big used to be a good football conference before Miami, Boston College, Virginia Tech went to the ACC …..
This card wants in!
Louisville makes sense. We fit in the Big 10 or the SEC. 5 Big 10 schools within a 4-5 hr drive, fans travel very well, a new 22,000 seat basketball arena that will be full every night, 56,000 seat football stadium that can be expanded to over 80,000 seats. Why the Big 10 would want pitt, rutgers or syracuse is beyond me. Those fans don’t travel well at all.
If you think the Big 10 would not gain nothing with louisville you are nuts! Look at the top bball schools profit and tv ratings. There is alot more to gain with louisville than mizzou. Your not gonna boost football in any aspect unless you get notre dame, not gonna happen. Louisville could be a very strong Big 10 city…tons of Indiana and Ohio St. fans live here in louisville. As a louisville fan I would love to play in the Big 10…and a football championship game!
I agree the Big 10 wants a school with good academics. Louisville is turning the corner. Mich. St..a Big 10 team did not become a member of the AAU for 10 years AFTER they joined the conference. Is there a double standard? Maybe Louisville joining the Big 10 would put Louisville on the next academic platform. TV? Louisville has some of the highest rated Bball games in the country. The louisville TV market every year has the top 5 market share during the NCAA basketball tourney. We are in the top 5 year in and out in Bball profits. We took alot more fans to Indy last year when we played Mich St. in the elite 8…alot more. It would not be a drop off in Bball for louisville going to the big 10. TV, fan base, profit at UofL are tops in the nation. Its a win win!
Big East football is in the crapper...
…and could lose its automatic BCS berth if ANY of the mentioned BE teams goes to the Big 10, unless we could get a top-tier team to replace them – and that simply is not going to happen. So I have to hope it’s us or nobody from the conference.
As for basketball, the BE has been strong the last couple of years, but go back a few more and you’ll find Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Illinois, and Indiana among the big-time programs. No one conference stays on top forever (ask the ACC). And a 16-team league is just too big. We don’t have room in the schedule for any non-conference games once the conference season starts. I long for the days when Denny’s teams would play a high-powered OOC opponent near the end of the season.
The Big 10 may not be THE premier conference in either sport, but is solid in both basketball and football year in and year out. We fit geographically much better with the Big 10 than we do with the East Coast-centric Big East.
Our academic image may not be up there, but we have a couple of highly regarded graduate schools and our reputation is improving. Louisville would add a moderately large and potentially much larger football stadium, an excellent basketball facility, and as good a number of butts in seats as anyone they could possibly get. Given that expansion is all about the Benjamins, I think our athletic standing and our reliable, well-traveled fan base would outweigh any perceived shortcomings on the academic side.
I don’t really expect it to happen, but I think we’d be the best choice for the Big 10; and I think we would be well advised to take the opportunity if it were to arise.
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