Strategy for hiring our next coach?
by Phauz on Oct 3, 2009 4:03 PM EDT
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PrintAm I jumping the gun a little bit with this post? Not really. I don't care if you are Steve Kragthorpe's grandma, there can't be too many people that think he'll be the coach at UofL next year. So, I am asking you, the CC community, what should be the strategy for hiring our next coach? Not, who per se the coach should be, but what should his profile look like.
I love UofL as much as anyone, but lets face it, its a good head coaching job but UofL isn't considered a "traditional football power", whatever that is. Given that, we are not going to hire Urban Meyer away from Florida, our next head coach will have a few flaws on experience or performance record. So, who do we want out of these candidates:
The unproven up-and-comer
Solid guy with a decent track record
Fall from glory
Coach with connections
Read the details and pros/cons after the jump...
Am I jumping the gun a little bit with this post? Not really. I don't care if you are Steve Kragthorpe's grandma, there can't be too many people that think he'll be the coach at UofL next year. So, I am asking you, the CC community, what should be the strategy for hiring our next coach? Not, who per se the coach should be, but what should his profile look like.
I love UofL as much as anyone, but lets face it, its a good head coaching job but UofL isn't considered a "traditional football power", whatever that is. Given that, we are not going to hire Urban Meyer away from Florida, our next head coach will have a few flaws on experience or performance record. So, who do we want out of these candidates:
The unproven up-and-comer:
Maybe a coordinator who hasn't had a head coaching job or has been head coach at only a very small school.
Pros: May be a good bargain on a capable coach and he'll be young enough to not retire any time soon. Bobby Petrino might fit this profile - great record as OC, but no head coaching experience.
Cons: Very high risk and only short-term reward. Either he'll be a total bust or he'll do great and be a flight risk to move on to a Big Ten / SEC school or to the NFL. (Yeah, Bobby definitely fits this profile)
Solid guy with a decent track record:
Successful headcoach at a nice C-USA/MAC//WAC school
Pros: Good track record against decent competition should give us some confidence that he'll be ready to step up to the Big East. Lots of great examples of great coaches that started at some MAC school...Brian Kelly at Cincy comes to mind. Also, this guys is probably older...still risk of moving on to the Big Ten / SEC (like John L), but not likely to go to the NFL
Cons: Think this is a low risk pick? Our current coach probably fits here...also, Ron Cooper. This guy probably isn't THAT great or else we're not going to lure him away...Chris Petersen isn't leaving Boise State for Louisville...maybe for Penn State or whatever.
Fall from glory
Experienced head coach with lots of historical success, but a bad run lately
Pros: Not likely to jump ship for a 'big name' program - would likely be his last job. Proof that he can be successful at some level. This could be a Tommy Tuberville or Charlie Weis this year. Anybody fired from the NFL fits in here. Maybe 1983 Schnellenberger fits in here (I don't think USFL was technically a "fall". bit he got dislodged from Miami to go to the USFL and that is the point. - a coach that good has to have something move them away from their last situation ) He'll have lots of experience....
Cons: ....sucking. This coach would have proven to the world that lately he can't win. He'll be a recognizable name for recruiting but not sure that would matter all that much (Lou Holtz at South Carolina, Ty Willingham at Washington)
Coach with connections
A current assistant or coordinator with ties to UofL as a player or coach
Pros: Could turn out like the up-and-comer, but more likely to stick around at UofL. Would have great rapport with fans, alumni, boosters. Could Jeff Brohm pan out for us?
Cons: Likely to have little or no head coaching experience (unless there is somebody I am not thinking of). Less likely to have as much upside as if we were to choose the best possible up-and-comer regardless of history with the school. Fans will sour on anyone if the wins don't start coming. If he is successful, I can't think of too many times where the historical connection has outweighed the money from the NFL (but far less likely to leave for a different BCS school)...actually, wait, Petrino fits in here...and he still left.
So, what do we think? I say we hire Nick Saban - guy seems like a winner.
Phauz
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Good post.. It's time for the discussion
The sooner the announcement re: Kragthorpe being fired the better. This season is done. The players are emotionless. Recruits are disinterested.
Petrino and Jurich established THE formula for successful Louisville football. A really smart coach + recruiting uber-athletic 3 stars from Florida and locking in the homerun local talent + fun football program (play-calling, top-notch facilities, PJCS music, smoke and environment).
There is a ceiling on recruiting at UofL. We will NEVER have Top 25 classes coming in here that can compete with likes of the SEC. Youtube ‘LSU cribs’ if you don’t believe me. Weather, women, and football fanatics. Louisville is 0 for 3 on those. That’s not to say we cannot compete with the best programs in the country. Petrino proved that.
But, we MUST have a really smart coach that can get more from less (contrast this with getting less from less as Koach has).
NO. FALL FROM GLORY – This was a great move for UL in the days of Schnellenberger. But, this program is way beyond this point. Way too tough for a Fall From Glory to Return To Glory (by definition, at a worse program and older).
NO. SOLID GUY WITH A DECENT TRACK RECORD – This guy can potentially recruit we;; but this kind of sounds like another Koach to me. We don’t need someone who can recruit (again, there’s a ceiling on our recruiting capability); we need someone who can coach a football team.
MAYBE. UNPROVEN UP-AND-COMING – I’m highly in favor of this if it is a guy with a sharp football mind. Like you said Phauz, this is risky but I think you under-estimated the potential long-term reward. I can see an up-and-coming coach staying and not bolting for a Cal or MSU or other more prestigious, yet all-things-considered, shitty program. There are always family reasons that cause coaches to stay and UL can compete at near the top level due to the BE.
MAYBE. COACH WITH UofL CONNECTIONS. This works depending on football acumen. I think Brohm and/or Jay Gruden are both probably worth the risk. Obviously Brohm leaving the program last season shouldn’t hurt his chances or diminish his resume.
Again, the big thing for me is the decision to hire a football coach over hiring a recruiter (i.e., I prefer a Petrino over a Lane Kiffin). I think a Petrino is much better for UofL. The way to keep the local talent here is convincing them that UL can win. Petrino kept Brohm and Bush not because he was a good recruiter but because he convinced them they could win.
My vote it UNPROVEN UP-AND-COMING (+ HIGH IQ).
agree with most of what you said
but where would you put Tuberville?
by UL is my hot hot sex on Oct 3, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Nice Phauz
…now get out of my head!
I guess it’s not that earth-shattering to say that the coaching change story will become a dominant topic here at CardChronicle for the remainder of the season.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Oct 3, 2009 5:50 PM EDT reply actions
My View
Phauz, it’s interesting that “Solid guy with a decent track record” won the poll, because Kragthorpe came from that category.
The question is whether the UofL football program is able to rise up again, similar to what John L. and Petrino did for the program post-Cooper. My gravest concern is that Kragthorpe may have done some damage to our recruiting pipeline. Ever since the days of Schnellenberger, we’ve been getting great recruits from FL, AL and GA. Think about it, just about every UofL guy in the NFL is from that area (Dumervil, Okoye, Rhodes, Douglas, Barnidge, Branch, Gay, etc.). I know we’ve still been getting guys from that area, but I think Krag has been more focused on JUCO and other geographies.
exactly
this is one of the most important things you look at when hiring a head coach in College FB—where does he recruit? What type of assistant coaches will he surround himself with and how experienced/good are they at recruiting the Louisville pipeline (FL, KY, OH, GA)?
Bringing in up-and-comer guys from out West is risky—any BCS coach can bring in 2 or 3 star talent but can they build those relationships in the South, in-state, and in Ohio to convince a few 4 or 5 star recruits that give their team the speed/size needed at skill positions? This is why fans want the big names b/c big names can go into a kid’s home and talk about the players he’s sent to the NFL, the championships he’s won, etc…to go along with all the facilities, fans, academic lines they feed the parents. Petrino did well without the big name but he had been working that pipeline for a few years prior to taking the Louisville job.
There’s plenty of coaches who have proven they can cultivate 3 star talent at non-BCS schools but you can’t build a BCS program on that—it’s just enough to get you a job at a good BCS school. You have to get guys with speed and size and when you’re relying on JUCO transfers for more than 10% of your class in the BCS, it typically reflects a deterioration of your pipeline—the pipeline that’s given Louisville guys like Peanut Whitehead, Brohm, Bush, Rhodes, Heyman etc…
That deterioration is cause for concern and is a big reason why fans are predicting a 5 to 7 year setback instead of the typical 2-4 year rebuilding period. This ain’t Florida and it ain’t USC, which is why Jurich will target a bigger name guy with proven recruiting experience in the South on his resume…someone like Tuberville or Fulmer, IMO.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Oct 4, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Strategy for hiring our next coach?
In my opinion, a good coach is one who takes the talent he has and finds a way to win….always looking for better players to come into the fold.
I agree
Is there really that big a talent gap between our current team and the rest of the BE? If Bobby P had the offensive players we have now…Froman/Burke, Vic/Bilal/Ashley, Long/Beaumont/Chichester/Graham….guaranteed we’d be putting up 40-50 points a game against the UKs and Utahs of the world.
We can’t ignore recruiting, but we should be able to win with these players. I totally reject the idea that we can’t be a winning program again in 1-2 years with the right coaching hire.
Players
During the recent 10 year “Bowl Eligible Era” of Louisville football, the Cardinals’ QBs and linemen were typically as good or better than every team on the schedule and were NFL-caliber players. Mix in the solid RBs and WRs/TEs throughout those years plus the occasional standout LB or S, and you have a consistent winning football program.
Are Froman and Burke NFL-level talents? Doubtful. Are they good enough to win in the Big East? Absolutely. Is there anyone on the Offensive or Defensive Line that will be drafted in the NFL? Time will tell but if you look at the stats from this season—there’s not much there to be happy about. I would also suggest that both lines are at or near the bottom of the Big East but that may be a little presumptious as the BE season has just begun.
To say that a better coach could develop the talent on the current roster is not a reach but there’s a big difference between Brian Brohm, Eric Wood and Elvis Dumervil and NC State transfer Justin Burke, JUCO transfer Froman, and…whomever makes up our O- and D- lines. I’m not so sure a new coach could take this talent and turn it around that fast (1-2 years) but at least we’re in the Big East and not the Pac-10 or SEC, so it’s not impossible.
by UL is my hot hot sex on Oct 5, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Be wary of
The unproven up-and-comer
See Gillispe, Billy
First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...
thats why Id rather have a
“fall from glory” Tuberville or Fulmer. ala Shnelly…you know they can already coach. Being in the “easiest” BCS conference can relieve some of the pressure on those guys and they can perform up to par once again.
We need a coach who has run a big time program before. I’m not saying we are a big time program a la Texas and Florida. But, John L. and Bobby benefited from getting on their feet in C-USA. Face it, we had maybe 2 tough games a year. Maybe. Now, we are playing 6 or 7 solid football clubs every season. We need someone who knows how to juggle the game plan, player preparation, player discipline, recruiting, and publicity week in and week out. You can’t take off in any of those categories in a BCS conference and expect to compete for a conference championship. You could in lesser leagues. That’s why I’m not high on an up and comer or even someone from with a solid track record in a lesser league. We need someone who can handle all the responsibilities to get the program back on track. If and when it is back to competing for the Big East crown, then I think you can take a risk on an innovative coordinator without head coaching experience. The paradigm has shifted for UofL right now.
This is exactly right
This isn’t Louisville C-USA. This is Louisville BCS. We don’t have time to mess around with unproven up-and-comers. That strategy has proven to be Kragtastically harmful to the program.
Now it’s time to do what Jurich should have done when Petrino bolted. Go get a proven commodity. Spend the bucks. Deal with the entourage and the huge ego. Or let’s all just face up to the harsh reality that this program will either be perpetually mired in mediocrity (at best) or doormat status in the Big East and a joke on the national scene.
NFL coordinator level?
An NFL top level guy for several reasons… 1 – big recruiting plus… “I know what they need and I’ll help you get to the next level”. 2 – No time to mess around with someone learning how to coach. 3 – Not likely to be dreamy eyed about a bunch of Auburn boosters flying in on a private plane.
Grog
"There is no OFF position to the genius switch" - D. Letterman
You all can have Bob Bratkowski
First time I shot her, shot her in the side.
Hard to watch her suffer, but with the second shot she died...
Snort!!!
“Thanks, but no thanks”… snicker….
Grog
"There is no OFF position to the genius switch" - D. Letterman
What about Bill Brasky?
Brasky’s ranked eighteenth in the AP College Football Poll.
He breast feeds John Madden.
He makes every woman that sleeps with him refer to him as Bear Bryant.
Brasky’s a son of a bitch!
ThreadKiller
Brasky, that sunnavabitch
He once dumped a bucket of gatorade on every fan in Happy Valley. Not just the stadium, but the entire valley.
I once saw him scissor kick Lee Corso.
Brasky invented the BCS system as an April fools joke.
Every kid on Boise State’s team was fathered by Brasky after that one “weekend getaway” to the mountains.
DocCardsFan
The 'Ville, KY
Guys, guys!!
You’re killin’ me. The people in the office next to me are wondering why I’m laughing so hard!
Grog
"There is no OFF position to the genius switch" - D. Letterman
MONEY
Money should be the strategy for find the next coach here.
UK showed Calipari the money and they got the guy they wanted.
Jurich should do the same. Spend some money to build this program, not just expand the stadium. 20,000 extra seats aren’t gonna matter if no one wants to go to the games. Jurich needs to knock one out of the park and drop a bombshell on this city to generate a buzz. Get the people excited and looking forward to something. Land a star coach.
________________________________________________
~LK
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www.youtube.com/lordkayossrippro
www.welcometomynightmare.tk
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